Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by J. Mikael on September 22, 2018 at 4:25pm

This looks like the real deal. The Ozzy's a little wonky, but overall a very nice looking piece.

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Permalink Reply by Matt S on September 22, 2018 at 6:24pm

Thank you J. Comment is appreciated.

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Permalink Reply by Greig on September 26, 2018 at 11:20pm

Look good

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Permalink Reply by J. Mikael on September 27, 2018 at 12:15am

Many things off compared to what? The Tony, Geezer and Bill autographs are text book examples of what their signatures from the past decade typically look like.

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Permalink Reply by J. Mikael on October 2, 2018 at 2:51am

Please do not twist my words, I never said the Ozzy was text book. I think it's authentic, but ugly, which happens a lot these days.

For the record, I've personally obtained dozens of autographs from all four original members of the band over the past two decades. If you're going to throw shade on what are clearly authentic autographs, please share with us the exemplars (of Tony, Geezer and Bill) you're comparing these to.

Geezer's "G" always comes back up and curves over the "Butler", sometimes with a more angular upstroke. The lower part of the "G" is sometimes looped, sometimes "V" shaped like here.

The first name in the Tony Iommi signature is quick and shortened, but not untypical in any way. Also, his autograph looks to be in paint pen while the others look like Sharpie. This line-up of the band wasn't together in 2010, Geezer and Tony were touring with Dio then. So these signatures were likely obtained on at least three separate occasions.

Bill's autograph hasn't looked considerably better than this at any point over the past 20 years. Here you've at least got the added "SABS" and the date, which look spot on.

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Permalink Reply by J. Mikael on October 3, 2018 at 4:56am

I'm not saying this is an actual common variation of Ozzy's signature, just that it's not uncommon for his autograph to be very sloppy (i.e. missing letters, etc.). What there is of it looks legit to me, if not very pretty (and this should be reflected in the price).

The sharp turn in the upstroke of the "G" in Geezer is probably to avoid hitting Ozzy's autograph, as from the eBay listing it looks like Geezer signed after him. Such turns and angles aren't uncommon either in my experience. There's one in the Geezer on the album currently listed on RR Auction (from the John Brennan Collection).

I agree that Tony typically signs with a light pressure. I had a look at some in my collection, and some are still way thicker than others due to the writing implement (eg. thick paint pen).

As for fake Bill Ward autographs in this style, can you please share links to some of those? I'm aware of the most common style that I posted below, but those look nothing like the real thing to me.

We're all just stating our informed opinions here. I just like to ask questions to avoid vagueness that might confuse collectors even more.

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Permalink Reply by goodcat on September 28, 2018 at 1:36pm

I more agree with Tim

They look off

Rarely does the B in Butler touch the straight portion of the Geezer above

These look more like the textbook forgery style we see these days IMO

I'm not calling them fake but sure ain't calling them authentic either 

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Permalink Reply by J. Mikael on October 2, 2018 at 2:55am

Off compared to what? Please show us what authentic Black Sabbath autographs from the past 10 years or so are supposed to look, if not like this.

I had a look at about 20 autographs from Geezer that I've obtained in-person, and the "B" in Butler touches the "G" in nearly half of them.

Also, for anybody familiar with Black Sabbath autographs, these look nothing like the cookie cutter fakes being sold eBay for $100 a piece.

Here's a comparison picture to illustrate the point:

Please feel free to present exemplars to the contrary.

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Permalink Reply by J. Mikael on October 3, 2018 at 5:45am

Out of curiosity I had a look through eBay for vinyls signed by all four original Black Sabbath members. I was quite surprised by the results. In total there were only 11 albums currently listed. In the $1000+ range 6 are authentic and 1 is fake (a common fake but certified by a TPA). Of the ones under $1000 3 are real and 1 is fake.

In the sold items I could see 9 fully signed albums. Out of those only 1 was real, while 8 were fake (mostly the common type) and sold in the $100-500 range.

Still, where have all the countless fakes gone? It almost looks like some kind of crackdown has gone down. This would be good news of course.

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Permalink Reply by Matt S on October 3, 2018 at 1:50pm

Thank you all for your opinions and the conversations that are happening between members. I am certainly learning a lot about this groups signature and is now provoking me to look for tell talr signs that a piece is genuine. 

By chance j. Mikael is this one that you have identified as real:

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Permalink Reply by J. Mikael on October 4, 2018 at 1:21am

That one looks good to me.

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Permalink Reply by Matt S on October 4, 2018 at 2:32am

Thank you J. Mikael. I had Roger look at this one this morning, came back genuine, so i pounced on it.

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