Mantle, Williams and DiMaggio: Authenticating Baseball Forger Favorites - Autograph Live2024-03-29T09:27:37Zhttps://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/mantle-williams-and-dimaggio?commentId=3524372%3AComment%3A79206&feed=yes&xn_auth=noDear sir, I was hoping you co…tag:live.autographmagazine.com,2022-05-26:3524372:Comment:17524922022-05-26T21:14:36.988ZDon Doughertyhttps://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/DonDougherty
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Dear sir, I was hoping you could send me a picture of the trick with the ruler or paper when checking out Mantle autographs my email is Donnienotoes@aol.com. thanks </span></p>
<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Dear sir, I was hoping you could send me a picture of the trick with the ruler or paper when checking out Mantle autographs my email is Donnienotoes@aol.com. thanks </span></p> It turns out that I have an a…tag:live.autographmagazine.com,2021-11-14:3524372:Comment:16903032021-11-14T20:06:50.473ZGilRhttps://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/GilR
<p>It turns out that I have an additional question for this thread, which strikes me as the perfect place to act. Back in 1987, having read somewhere that some retired baseball players might be more likely to sign positive newspaper articles than just photos or baseball cards, I clipped a New York Times article about Joe DiMaggio that had a great photo of him and mailed it him. A few weeks later it came back with a great signature. Does anyone know whether DiMaggio around that time would have…</p>
<p>It turns out that I have an additional question for this thread, which strikes me as the perfect place to act. Back in 1987, having read somewhere that some retired baseball players might be more likely to sign positive newspaper articles than just photos or baseball cards, I clipped a New York Times article about Joe DiMaggio that had a great photo of him and mailed it him. A few weeks later it came back with a great signature. Does anyone know whether DiMaggio around that time would have had someone else signing for him, or can I be confident that it's genuine? It's the best autograph in my collection, assuming it is indeed real. Thanks!</p>
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<p></p> I am a new member and have a…tag:live.autographmagazine.com,2021-11-13:3524372:Comment:16900262021-11-13T22:30:39.431ZGilRhttps://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/GilR
<p>I am a new member and have a question, and this thread seems the right place for it. I have a Ted Williams autographed baseball that may or may not be genuine, and want to get your thoughts about it. I recently had to remove from my parents' house the collection of baseball cards and autographs that I put together as a teenager around 1986-1990, and am starting to sell a few items -- and, having returned to the hobby after thirty years, I've discovered the importance of first having cards…</p>
<p>I am a new member and have a question, and this thread seems the right place for it. I have a Ted Williams autographed baseball that may or may not be genuine, and want to get your thoughts about it. I recently had to remove from my parents' house the collection of baseball cards and autographs that I put together as a teenager around 1986-1990, and am starting to sell a few items -- and, having returned to the hobby after thirty years, I've discovered the importance of first having cards graded and autographs authenticated. Here is the situation with this baseball, and why I am asking forum members for their insights.</p>
<p>Around 1986 or 1987 I decided to try to have a ball signed by all living members of the 500 homer club and, instead of starting from scratch, while at an autographs and cards show I bought a Ted Williams baseball which I then got signed by Willie Mays, Ernie Banks and Harmon Killebrew. So it has three autographs that I know are genuine, but at some point I learned about autographs being forged, and have always wondered about this Williams signature. If I knew for certain it's legitimate I would want to have all four signatures authenticated and put the ball on the market (while keeping other autographed baseballs that I got from those three in person). Since the raw cost of authenticating a Williams autographed ball is $75, plus there are associated expenses, that's a pretty big gamble to take without knowing more.</p>
<p>I have spent a good two hours or so online doing a deep dive into the world of Williams authenticated signatures and forgeries (using this thread, PSA's webpage on the subject, photos of numerous authenticated balls on eBay, and other online discussions), and now know enough that I was able to spot a clear fake going for $300 on eBay, but I'm still uncertain about this one. Here is my thinking, and I would very much like to get yours based on the photo I'm uploading:</p>
<p>* I can find no signature that it matches precisely, though most of the letters are quite close to those in numerous authenticated signatures.<br/>* Each of the letters that looks different from the ones in Williams's standard autograph has at least one parallel out there. In other words, while the signature as a whole doesn't match any I could find, each component does have a genuine match.<br/>* The biggest argument against authenticity is the 's', since pretty much every Williams signature ends with a diagonal, downwards line that goes below the rest of the 's'. However, there is a signed personal check on PSA's Ted Williams webpage -- the "1983 Ted Williams Signed Check" at <a rel="nofollow noopener" href="https://www.psacard.com/autographfacts/baseball/ted-williams/images/46" target="_blank">https://www.psacard.com/autographfacts/baseball/ted-williams/images/46</a> -- that shows an 's' like the one in the photo, so it's not impossible, and the overall shape of the 's' is about right. Moreover, if this is a forgery then it seems a rather good one, and a good forger would have to know about getting the 's' right -- which, perversely, seems a solid argument for authenticity. After all, there's no reason why Williams, having been signing dozens if not hundreds of balls at a show, might not have eased up a little when reaching the end of this one. (My memory could be faulty, but I have a hazy recollection of the dealer who sold me this ball saying he had had it signed by Williams at a recent autograph appearance. If so, as a dealer he would have had Williams sign a number of balls one after the other, so Williams might have been a bit less careful about getting each one perfect.)<br/>* The 'T' ends with a horizontal line that normally goes through the 'e', but here goes just above it, which is unusual.<br/>* The 'm' is formed strangely, but there are other examples that are similar to it.<br/>* The 'i' in most Williams signatures normally begins a bit above the line and then descends before going up, but there are several examples that instead look like this.</p>
<p>So, is there something that makes this clearly a forgery, or does it clearly look genuine? Or, does it look genuine enough that it's worth the $100+ to have a professional take a look? And, if it's either deemed a definite forgery or PSA is too uncertain to state it is authentic, am I right that this renders the other autographs valueless?</p>
<p>I'm sorry about<a href="https://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/9799326678?profile=original" target="_blank" rel="noopener"><img src="https://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/9799326678?profile=RESIZE_710x" class="align-full"/></a> the long post, but want to be as well informed as I can be. Plus after all of the time I've spent studying this and other signatures that spell out "Ted Williams" I find it an interesting subject, regardless of whether the ball is worth $500 or $5. Thank you for reading all this, and for any thoughts you might wish to share.</p>
<p></p> not authentictag:live.autographmagazine.com,2021-11-08:3524372:Comment:16873692021-11-08T00:43:43.393Zterrier8HOFhttps://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/terrier8HOF
<p>not authentic</p>
<p>not authentic</p> Greetings! I am a brand new m…tag:live.autographmagazine.com,2021-11-06:3524372:Comment:16868972021-11-06T19:01:58.663ZLynn Sheeley IVhttps://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/LynnSheeleyIV
<p>Greetings! I am a brand new member and have just run across this Joe DiMaggio Ball at an Estate Sale. What do you guys think about this Signature? It’s signed on a nice Bobby Brown Ball and displayed in a really nice Wood base tiered display case. The owner claims she bought it at Yankee Stadium.</p>
<p> Thanks for your help!!!!!</p>
<p>Greetings! I am a brand new member and have just run across this Joe DiMaggio Ball at an Estate Sale. What do you guys think about this Signature? It’s signed on a nice Bobby Brown Ball and displayed in a really nice Wood base tiered display case. The owner claims she bought it at Yankee Stadium.</p>
<p> Thanks for your help!!!!!</p> I have one for a Marino...was…tag:live.autographmagazine.com,2020-06-18:3524372:Comment:14790162020-06-18T03:26:36.246ZBrandon Bottelsonhttps://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/BrandonBottelson
<p>I have one for a Marino...wasted 30 bucks just for Beckett to laugh at me</p>
<p>I have one for a Marino...wasted 30 bucks just for Beckett to laugh at me</p> Thanks Christopher!! I’m goin…tag:live.autographmagazine.com,2017-11-12:3524372:Comment:11362862017-11-12T20:45:10.469ZMwat9050https://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/Mwat9050
Thanks Christopher!! I’m going to read them now! All the info you guys have provided has been amazing. So great to have guys like you in this hobby!
Thanks Christopher!! I’m going to read them now! All the info you guys have provided has been amazing. So great to have guys like you in this hobby! Mwat9050, when you get a chan…tag:live.autographmagazine.com,2017-11-12:3524372:Comment:11361342017-11-12T20:42:28.317ZCJCollectorhttps://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/ChristopherWilliams
<p>Mwat9050, when you get a chance, please read related threads below.</p>
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<p><a href="https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/ebay-mantle-dimaggio-forgeries-gfa-steve-rocchi-certified" target="_blank">https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/ebay-mantle-dimaggio-forgeries-gfa-steve-rocchi-certified…</a></p>
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<p>Mwat9050, when you get a chance, please read related threads below.</p>
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<p><a href="https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/ebay-mantle-dimaggio-forgeries-gfa-steve-rocchi-certified" target="_blank">https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/ebay-mantle-dimaggio-forgeries-gfa-steve-rocchi-certified</a></p>
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<p><a href="https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/roger-maris-forgeries-on-ebay-stephen-rocchi-gfa" target="_blank">https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/roger-maris-forgeries-on-ebay-stephen-rocchi-gfa</a></p>
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<p><a href="https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/joe-dimaggio-forgeries-on-ebay-gfa-steve-rocchi-certified" target="_blank">https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/joe-dimaggio-forgeries-on-ebay-gfa-steve-rocchi-certified</a></p> Unbelievably amazing thread h…tag:live.autographmagazine.com,2017-11-12:3524372:Comment:11362832017-11-12T20:38:18.597ZMwat9050https://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/Mwat9050
Unbelievably amazing thread here guys. I’m about half way through it and I’ve learned so much! Thank you all!!
Unbelievably amazing thread here guys. I’m about half way through it and I’ve learned so much! Thank you all!! MEARS is top-notch at authent…tag:live.autographmagazine.com,2017-04-20:3524372:Comment:10605382017-04-20T03:45:59.747ZSteve Cyrkin, Adminhttps://live.autographmagazine.com/profile/SteveCyrkin
<p>MEARS is top-notch at authenticating game-used equipment, which is what they were used for here. Beckett did the autograph authentication, and they're very good as well. Steve Grad with Beckett most likely authenticated this ball for Goldin.</p>
<p>MEARS is top-notch at authenticating game-used equipment, which is what they were used for here. Beckett did the autograph authentication, and they're very good as well. Steve Grad with Beckett most likely authenticated this ball for Goldin.</p>