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Authenticity is Everything
Wanted: Pat Tillman Autograph.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by mbitter on
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Rick, I have a pat tillman autographed team photo. I had it signed when I worked at asu. Interested?
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Permalink Reply by Rick Meyer on
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Sent you a friend request.
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Mike, I have this autograph. It is a football he autographed for me the day he and Kevin joined the Army. He wrote 'Army leads the way...' and then signed below. Would like to discuss more in private if possible. I will send pics if in more private forum. Thanks for your time.
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I have an autographed photo of Pat tilman flipping off i think Dallas fans. its for sale. 480-228-8697
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Permalink Reply by Pristine Auction (Jared Kavlie) on
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I'm interested. Can you send a scan of the photo? Please message me with the image and your asking price.
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I hope it wasn't the one I saw on Craigslist in Phoenix a couple months ago. Signature on that Dallas photo was a forgery.
Is this your photo?
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Craig, I've seen you pop on here since I responded. Let's see the photo you have or is it the one I posted?
You even got the Pristine Auction guy on here interested in buying it. He might even be able to get a JSA certificate on it and sell it anyway.
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Rick,
Why the negativity? I'm not sure if the photo you posted here is the photo being offered or not, I have not heard from Craig. I'm not sure a fair authenticity opinion can be made off of the small fuzzy photo that you posted though? I know you have participated in some past Pat Tillman discussions. Do you have some single signed Tillman items that you can post that you feel are authentic?
I personally did in person autographs back when Tillman was an Arizona Cardinal. He was a great about signing daily walking into Sun Devil Stadium. I got him a few times myself but never on a single signed item. I have only seen a handful of authentic single signed items. His autograph on a single signed items seems to vary from the smaller signatures typically seen on the multi-signed items.
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Jared,
I have a few Tillman signed items left. I traded many and gave some away. Some are posted on here. I can dig you out more and shoot them to you privately if you'd like.
The photo I posted was offered on Craigslist at one time. I saved it. It disappeared when I sent a message to the seller. There is enough in that fuzzy photo to tell that the signature is not authentic. It may not be the same photo.
As for single signed Tillman items they are out there. More Cardinals stuff than there is ASU. His signatures are a little larger but the same basics of the signature remain the same. They do differ a bit on how he crosses the T and the formation of the P. When you look at Tillman single signed things you need to look at the items being signed. The logo on the Cardinals helmet for example. Saw a new logo authenticated by GA. Another is ASU #42 jerseys. Show me an ASU #42 jersey outside a team issued one that was produced before Tillman was killed by any company. I'd be interested in seeing one yet JSA authenticated one. Matter of fact I think it's in your auction. You can believe this is authentic because JSA issued a certificate but it isn't.
https://www.pristineauction.com/a186596-Pat-Tillman-Signed-ASU-42-S...
I posted about that signed jersey when I saw it on EBAY and the story from the guy saying it was given to him by a friend and yada, yada, yada. I even predicted JSA would pass it cause they are horrible with Tillman signatures.
http://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/interesting-pat-till...
There is a single signed Cardinal mini helmet on EBAY right now authenticated by PSA being sold by a very reputable dealer. No chance that it is authentic. Has check mark starts to his signature. Wonder where they found that exemplar?
Some folks don't care as long as they get a certificate with it. Doesn't make the signature authentic.
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I believe the Tillman ASU jersey in our auction is absolutely authentic. JSA passed the jersey after having multiple authenticators agree on the authenticity. When a high end item (like the Tillman jersey) is presented to JSA, the decision is only made after the jersey is seen by several JSA lead authenticators and consultants. They work hard to make sure that the right decision is made. I completely agree with their decision to deem the autograph on the ASU jersey as authentic. It's quite an incredible item!
If you could post some images of single signed Tillman autographed items that you believe are authentic here that would be great for the discussion. Thanks!
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Jared, you are a dealer. Of course that is your stance. Many who deal items that they purchased that are questioned take your stance. If not you just lost money. You have a JSA certificate so you have an outside authentication company that many believe in 100%. Good for you. You'll make money selling this.
We cannot have good dialogue on this because one of us has a vested interest in the item. It only works when we are both unbiased parties in the signature.
JSA authenticated it. With the fee they charge to authenticate a Tillman I would challenge your theory of how many of their folks looked at it. I wonder how many Tillman items those folks ever collected themselves. I'd be willing to bet very few. But I am familiar with their process.
I've probably got Tillman more then 50 times while he was at ASU, was a Cardinal and after he enlisted. On top of that I copy and save every one I see whether it is authentic or not. Cardinal autographs are my thing. I doubt I could get 100% accuracy of Tillman signatures but no question I could get them right more often then the band of authenticators at JSA or PSA.
That jersey is a Starter. It is a cheap bootleg of the jerseys ASU issued to support the Tillman foundation. Show me another Starter jersey like it that was produced before Tillman was killed. Those popped up all over the place after his death.
Here is a close up of the signature. Is the bottom of the "P" connected to the "at"? Follow this signature and look at the backtracking and/or double tracking of the signature. Try and create that pattern in a single swiped signature. Then show me an authentic one you think is similar to that. I'd be curious to see it.
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Correct, I am a dealer. But, I was an in person autograph collector for many years first here in Phoenix and I love this hobby. We do everything we can to ensure that every autograph that we offer is authentic. I appreciate you posting the up close image of the jersey that we are offering, can you now post some single signed items that you believe are authentic? I think it will help the discussion.
JSA did an auction house LOA on this item for us. The fees are significantly lower than a full LOA. They did not pass this autograph for the authentication fee and that implication is completely unfair. I presented this jersey to them while they were in our office. It took 2 days before a final decision was made and that's because it was confirmed by several authenticators before it was passed.
To answer your question, the "P" is not connected to the "at" on the jersey.
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