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Authenticity is Everything
Ten Warning Signs a Dealer May Be Selling Autograph Forgeries
Wrote this recently and sent out to my newsletter subscribers, and posted on my website. Thought it would be helpful in here. Feel free to add to the list..
There have been countless write-ups and articles about what to look for when it comes to buying autographs. Most have the same basic information such as “if too good to be true”, compare to known exemplars, secretarials, autopens, etc. Therefore, instead of regurgitating the technical aspects of authentication, the focus here will be “autograph dealers”. What specifically to look for in a dealer’s presentation, reputation and behavior that may trigger a “red flag” that something is “not right”. Consequently, as more suspicious autograph sellers appear on the market; this will hopefully equip collectors with the data that will help avert a costly, painful experience. . Listed below are primarily my own personal experiences over the last 30 years of collecting. And although a particular behavioral element may not always necessarily indicate dishonest intentions, there have been countless scenarios in my own collecting life that such noted behaviors have been consistent with "questionable" autograph sellers.
1). Whether you are buying on eBay or a suspicious looking website, always look for a ”pattern”. These patterns may be in the form of consistency in the configuration of the signature, type pen used, medium used, most of inventory conveniently UN-inscribed and imaginary supply. Ten years ago when forgers were even more prolific on eBay than today, you could usually look at their “Other Items for Sale” and notice a fishy consistency with all their “autographs”. Eventually, coming to the conclusion the SAME person was manufacturing all the autographs. Also, many suspect dealers have an "imaginary supply" of highly scarce items. For example, one website that sells autographed movie posters always seems to have plenty of "Godfather" signed movie posters including Marlon Brando's autograph. Not only is this scarce, a genuine Marlon Brando signed "Godfather" poster has never appeared on the market. If one ever does it will sell for several thousand dollars, not $399 as this particular site sells for.
2). The seller does not issue a COA and claims they are worthless. What he is really saying is, if you ever request a refund because the autograph is deemed a fake there will be no documented guarantee and hence no recourse for you to get a refund.
3). The seller’s inventory (i.e. website) is “unnatural”. What that means is an inventory of Genuine autographs will have a dramatic diversity including NOT just photos and signed pieces of paper, but mediums that are highly unlikely to be forged including personal checks, contracts, letters (especially on celebrity stationary) , official documents like presidential appointments, etc. When the inventory begins to look too much like common stock, i.e. easily forged glossy photos and paper cuts and most or all items are NOT inscribed, a red flag should go up. Most of the forgery businesses I have seen are all on “easy to create medium” like glossy photos, programs, books, and pieces of paper. One popular tactic for sellers of autograph forgeries is to buy old books and tear out the blank pages and use fountain pens to forge the signatures with a vintage appearance. However, most of the time the newly applied fountain pen ink has a very distinctive, “unnatural” look to it. Quite different from ink that has aged over a 50 year period.
4). Nothing or Very Little of the seller’s inventory has been verified by a 3rd party authentication service like JSA or PSA.
5). Suspect Seller has an aversion to independent authentication. Most suspect sellers will try to convince you that industry recognized 3rd party autograph authentication services are not credible. What they might really be saying is “I don’t want anyone to have the power to reveal my autographs are fake”.
6). Prices are often a fraction of true value. For example, there is a website that sells such rare items like Boris Karloff autographed “Frankenstein” photos for about $500. The market will not allow this to happen. If a genuine signed “Frankenstein” appears for sale it will sell for no less than $5000. PLUS, even if there was an extremely rare chance such a photo was acquired for such low cost it would not last a day as experienced collectors would buy them immediately and you would see a “sold out” on the item.
7). PROVENANCE and/or Proof of Purchase. Suspect sellers, in particular blatant forgers, will have no proof of purchase for items on their websites. If in question ask WHERE they acquired, and proof. Certainly they must have receipts for some of their items. Of course no dealer is going to reveal what they paid for an item and may not want to share their source. But, any reputable dealer has receipts for items they have purchased other than specific items you are interested in buying. An unethical dealer engaged in selling autograph forgeries will NOT have REAL provenance or proof of purchase for probably any items you sample from his/her inventory.
8). Most suspect sellers will have no credible affiliations with industry recognized organizations. A credible affiliation is an organization that holds their members accountable. For example, if you are a member of the UACC and you are openly selling fake autographs, you will be banned. In the past such fraudulent activity even landed the seller on the UACC Hall of Shame list. Organizations which do NOT hold members accountable like the Manuscript Society or Better Business Bureau should NOT be any indication that the dealer is reputable, as the only criteria to maintain membership is a membership fee (what does the BBB know about autographs??). . And as mentioned before, ask the seller if they are a member of an organization like the UACC and listen for his/her reaction (is it hostile?). Listen for an air of suspicion in their rationale of WHY they are not a member? Look for the atypical behavior of someone engaged in illicit activity. A bizarre behavioral aspect always comes to the surface, eventually, often in the form of a hostile or defensive persona. I am not a psychologist, this is based on my own experiences and experiences others have shared with me.
*NOTE: Be careful of autograph websites that do NOT display images of all their autographs. This is one way for some "suspect" dealers to avoid the close scrutiny of "expert eyes" within the autograph community.
9). There is an uncanny familiar behavior when a suspect seller is “called out” or questioned about their autographs. Since a seller of autograph forgeries cannot defend their products, the result is often vehement, personal attacks against those who question them.
10). Ask them for a rare item that is not listed on their site. For example, a “Rat Pack” signed photo, a George Reeves as “Superman” signed photo, or an Abraham Lincoln signature.. If the dealer all of a sudden produces such a rare piece that is inconsistent with their "available" inventory, it probably just came out of the oven. (Of course this is probably not be the case with an industry known dealer who, for example with an Abe Lincoln signature, specializes in historical autographs).
10b). BEFORE you buy an expensive autograph, ask the dealer if they guarantee it will pass PSA or JSA and if it fails will they refund in full? BEFORE YOU BUY. Don’t assume the dealer’s COA or guarantee will be honored AFTER you buy. Most unscrupulous dealers know the cost of litigating a fake autograph usually is not worth it. Also, if possible have a reputable dealer you may know for an opinion on the item. Or submit it to PSA for “quick opinion”. If the opinion is negative tell the dealer you checked one particular autograph on his site and the opinion was “not genuine”. You are not only looking to determine whether the autograph itself is suspect, you are also being vigilant for a particular “behavior”. If the dealer displays a hostile reaction to other dealers or authentication services, such defensive behavior (in my own personal experience) often signals a dealer with something to hide.
10c). (yes, I know this makes #12) The suspect dealer will have no REAL testimonials on their website. Some websites post fake testimonials which usually have some initials and very generic info like a state. Trust me, Happy customers leave REAL testimonials with their REAL identity.
10d). (OK, 13 warning signs, this is it). The dealer's Guarantee of Authenticity is vague and has a time limit. Most reputable autograph dealers offer a Lifetime Guarantee , i.e. NO time limit.
10e). This list keeps growing. But, this is very important....
One very important “sign” I failed to not only include but Emphasize. And that is the dealer who has “hair trigger lawsuit”. You know him. The dealer that is always ready to pull out the "l’ll sue you card” the minute you confront his/her questionable autographs. This goes back to previous examples of how a suspect dealer will NOT be concerned or even curious about a bad autograph he may be selling. And, many times not even surprised. In the past, whenever I inquired about a suspicious looking autograph being sold by an honest seller, they were always very concerned such as “how do you know”, “can you tell me more”, etc etc. The suspicious seller, on the other hand, is not interested in hearing any such feedback as the most unethical seller most likely already knows he/she is selling forgeries. Instead, the suspect seller’s only response is to silence any whistle-blowers that may threaten his/her illegal activity. And threatening a law suit is a very common intimidation tool for them to employ.
Now I realize there are reputable dealers that may fail one of the above tests. For example, an opinion from one dealer may tick off another reputable dealer and result in a hostile reaction. However, the point is to look for an overall behavior, a pattern. A blatantly dishonest dealer will surely fail several of the above tests. Also, opinions of authentication services continue to be an endless debate in the collecting community. However, there is no one that loathes the 3rd party authentication services more than the “forgery industry”, for obvious reasons. At the same time, the sometimes volatile competence of 3rd party authenticators is a legitimate debate that will live on, hopefully for the betterment of the industry. The industry wide “forgery containment” value of 3rd party authentication on the other hand, is undeniable.
** In the coming weeks I will be doing a video of basic autograph authentication and demonstrate some of the techniques used to determine the difference between a genuine and fake autograph
Kevin Conway
Helpful Resources:
A community of reputable autograph dealers and collectors:
Autograph Magazine Forum
A Great database of vintage Hollywood genuine signature exemplars:
The CEAD
Detailed Autograph Authentication Report :
Conway's Vintage Treasures Authentication Report
The Oldest Autograph Collecting Organization with Approved Dealer Program Directory:
UACC Dealers
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by CJCollector on
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Mike, you make a good point that "most of us know this already." Many of us here get accused of being repetitive and redundant, but in exposing forgeries I believe being repetitive and redundant is necessary. When I was doing my YouTube videos I was accused of showing the same crap from Coach's Coach's week after week, but the point of that was to saturate various searches so that it has a chance that a newbie will find it.
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Well done, Kevin.
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Permalink Reply by DB on
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always good to have a refresher. We ought to take these and put them into a primer for autograph collector section as there are a number of them through-out AML.
Couple of points - I cringe when I see an item that refers to PSA or JSA as the end all be all. Especially where they don't "stand behind" the opinion. For a novice, agreed, they have a better chance of perhaps not being ripped off. However, there are a number of "independents" that are far superior especially in vertical segments.
The "guarantee" part on EBAY if I recall correctly has been enforced that they have to "provide" refunds within so many days. There is definitely often times confusion between the listing return and the item's description "guarantee" and which one will take precident.
The point of provenance is also a slippery slope. Many reputable auction sites will merely say, "the received it from the "very trusted consignor" -or- the "employee" on the west coast. I've had that said many times when asking provenance questions. Then when asking ebay sellers one often gets the "vague" response which also doesn't mean it's not authentic or in the case of one UACCRD seller on Heston there was an inperson signing picture except it was incredibly false. This is probably an area that needs a good discussion and flushing out.
& 10f - Check the EBAY Banned List as those listed didn't make it there because they are Poster Childs for good authentication practices... Just because it's certified doesn't means it authentic.
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Permalink Reply by David Jackson on
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Here is a bad fake baseball. wonder how long ebay keeps this one up?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/YANKEES-LEGENDS-AUTOGRAPHED-BASEBALL-JETER-...
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Lifetime guarantees rarely are. It is very easy to circumvent a lifetime guarantee after the fact. A scammer can simply choose to not accept the authenticity opinions presented, even if there is concrete proof an item is a fake.
When Moodys rates bad securities as AAA they use the same arguments third-party authenticators do: they are only providing an opinion. Until there is true recourse against paid-for opinions, they are worthless, even when they are right. They help dealers more than collectors, even though they may prevent some people buying fakes. In the end they are only opinions. And unless the bad items are actually destroyed, there is always somebody holding a bad security, and they will find their way back into the market, and someone else will be turned away from collecting as a result of bad purchases.
In the end, the autograph marketplace is always one person's word or opinion against another's word or opinion. Trust is paramount, and honestly it is hard to give even to the most reputable dealers. For those on the outside, it is easier to find disreputable sources, as they seem to far out number the reputable ones. My simpler solution is just to not purchase autographs.
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Permalink Reply by kevin conway on
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My first question would be, "Then WHY are you here"? So than no one should buy baseball cards, Fine Art, antique toys, EVEN Vintage Movie Posters, etc etc etc? Which ALL have Forgeries in the marketplace. It is a very narrow way to live your life. A Better answer, might be "educate yourself" because when you study the unique characteristics of a painting, a signature, vintage advertising posters, etc you will be amazed at what a skilled "eye" can detect 99% of the time.
"Don't be afraid your life will end; be afraid it will never begin." - Grace Hansen
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Permalink Reply by Markus Brandes on
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Hi Kevin.
Thanks for sharing those nice checklist to the autograph community.
Would you allow me to publish it as well with your reference on my autograph advice website www.autograph-market.com ?
kind regards
Markus
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Sure Markus
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Permalink Reply by Robert C Stead on
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See...I always avoided autographs, took some chances when the exposure wasn't high. I have gone to an auction for months now and after seeing Marty Bystroms and signed letters and cancelled checks as well as 8x10's, psa graded cards, sections of albums from 1960's and 70's I grabbed various items but ultimately did not get out bid on some "items", which pretty much instantly got panned here. I was told the items were coming from a store that had been around for a while but was closing and they were retiring. Whatever...but I never heard of the coa's , and folks commenting on them have compelling arguments why they think they are forged. But then I read this and it's a mixed bag of good and bad signs that tell me I may have the real deal. I mean, they have a signed Robert Person jersey...who the heck has that?
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Permalink Reply by James Lafaman on
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This really is a great piece and very helpful in many ways. Thanks for sharing it. I learn something new every day. Points 7 and 8 are tough standards though. I am going to sell for the first time in August. 1. Most of my items are in person signatures. So I would not have a proof of purchase or a receipt. Some that I have purchased were many, many years ago and I keep every COA, but I don't keep a receipt for anything I own except maybe my house and cars, from 10-20-30 years ago? 2. The UACC requires you to be a member for 3 years and get two other UACC members as references in order to make you a dealer member. I know this now because I just inquired. As a life long collector and chaser, I never thought to be a UACC member until now, as I had no compelling reason to do so. So it will be three years before I can get a dealer approval from them. 3. Authenticators charge money. In some cases a lot of money. Paying them to tell me that something I got myself is legit, seems like a huge waste of money and in many cases would make the items too pricey for the average buyer. Maybe not the die hard collector or someone looking for a very specific piece, but for the average street graph from modern entertainment, sports or music, it overprices the item. I often marvel at sellers who have a JSA or PSA cert on everything and then list them at very low prices. Personally, that concerns me, knowing how much they charge. How did they do that? How can they sell them so cheap? 4. I had one authenticator tell me with a very sly smile that people buy "certs nowadays" not autographs. That's scary, because that would give them way too much power and could give them the ability to dictate market prices. Essentially taking the profit out of selling, similar to athletes / promoters charging insane prices at shows, reducing any margin on a potential sale to a miniscule number. 4a. I watch them now set up at shows and "authenticate" items that were literally just signed at the show and they get a nice fee for it? Is that science or forensic know how? Does that require years of expertise or modern technology? No, no and no. All that requires is a cash register and a credit card machine. At what point are we all beholden to them to establish the market and in some cases inflate it?
I didn't respond to argue or disagree. On the contrary, I really am learning a lot on this site and value everyone's opinion including those who disagree with me. I am only pointing out the difficulty some of these standards would place on a new dealer, who is trying to do everything the right way. You can probably also tell by many of my comments on this site, that I can be a contrarian and things to me are never quite as simple or black and white as they appear to be. Interested in your thoughts......
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Re: "I had one authenticator tell me with a very sly smile that people buy "certs nowadays" not autographs."
You are always going to get varying and subjective opinions on this topic. I don't look at it like that. Sure PSA in particular has high fees and several up-sells. And, of course the "accuracy" debate will never end. But, when you look at it in relative terms, i.e. NO Second Opinion vs a skilled opinion (even though that skill level varies especially when they get into Non-sports), the second opinion of course wins out all the time. Yes even though it is fee based. And, this is ever so important when you have so many Blatant Forgers out there that the IN-experienced eye cannot detect.
For item 7 I am not suggesting a proof of purchase from a dealer is required. The point I was trying to convey is a dealer selling forgeries will NEVER have a proof of purchase and hence you always have that option available to you if for example you are making a major purchase or have suspicions about a certain seller. But however you look at it, it is an unquestionable differentiating factor. An unscrupulous autograph seller will NEVER have any proof of purchase for his/her inventory.
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You are right of course and I appreciate the response. Unofrtunately, so many forgers have created a lucrative business for the authenticators and made it more difficult for honest sellers to compete with cheap garbage. But setting up a table at shows to authenticate what was just signed seems to have taken this to a new level. I am going to do my best to be one of the good guys and have some fun meeting people and telling stories.
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