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Authenticity is Everything
Secretarial Autographs: Post Yours Here
Note: 11/3/2011 THREAD RULEs;
1. If You are gonna post a picture in this Thread then PLEASE leave it POSTED. When there is commentary for it or comparisons & then removed the Thread overall has a problem and many, including me, don't know what the heck someone is/was talking about. If it's a personally owned one then put a watermark on it if that's a worry. But DON"T Delete. I do from time to time copy them just in case but now always" . 11/3/2011
2. If you are posting an item from an "auction" site (ebay etc...) then pls post the actual picture, and then a link to it along with the "auction" or source site. Links become dated and items disappear for a variety of reasons (12/4/2011)
As one wanders around the WWW on auction sites or blogs it is inevitable that the "secretarials" verbiage will arise. There are many breakout discussions (see a partial list below that hopefully, I captured the greater majority of threads) and in typical fashion we deviate on many threads (which I have not captured) and throw in a secretarial here & there.
Many times the secretarials focus on the high end selling items as opposed to the mid level ones e.g. The Honeymooners. Of course, the secretarials differ, at least in verbiage, to the Clubhouse, AutoPen or outright forgeries (there are lots of good threads on) but that is not for this discussion.
But back to the midlevel ones like Roy & Dale Evans, Barbara Striesand, Mary Tyler Moore or Tony Curtis to mention a few. I will add 3 pictures of authentic ones (there may be variations) for the latter three but don't have the secretarials for a side by side (which I like to see as it provides a good visual). Anyone have some? So at the risk of biting off too much (if an area takes off, perhaps I can create a breakout thread for it) what are OTHER KNOWN Secretarials and their Authentic ones and why Secretarials?
for reference only;
http://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/most-forged-signatur...
http://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/charlton-heston-secr... Charlton Heston
Then we have the unfortunate masacree Vanderhoven Threads;
Montgomery Clift; http://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/montgomery-clift-opi...
Tags: fakes, secretarials
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by DB on
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I suppose this could sneak in as a "Secretarial"
It is Woodward and Paul Newman Signing in for each other;
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Raquel Welch - are there any secretarials as I have to wonder with all the requests were they always signed by her... Okay, circa 1967 and One Million BC...
^ ONe Million BC!
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Here are some authentic Welch signatures... Notice the similarities and yet the differences as well. More to come.. Does anyone have any TTM ones? Notice how different it is from the '67 version.
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and speaking of apparently secretarial Raquels based on knowledgeable sources... we have these from our friends at ebay;
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Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on
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How do you know these are secretarial?
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there is always the possibility of a forgery but they don't typically use Jackie gleason salutation. they look too neat to be forgeries when contrasted to the 2 forged ones on ebay with a psa cert and look like nothing like this authentic one or the authentic ones previously posted.
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Here are a few examples that i have received. Although i do not know for sure on any of them, i have heard them questioned over and over and so am including them for others to judge. One auto i couldnt get a good scan of, but believe for sure is a secretarial is Shia Lebouf (not sure of spelling), but his IP doesnt match his TTM really at all, at least what ive seen, but its a very simple TTM sig in any event , so who knows. Anyway i hope these help to add to the discussion, and again im not for sure they are, i have just heard them debated many times.
Chris
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Ok, good list; calling in our top notch independents as well as where are our very insightful dealers (like Bobby's guys out on R&R).
I'd put out the call for others but they might still try to convince themselves that Chris' Charlton Heston about is authentic when it is a classic secretarial.
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Chris, finally heard back and it probably confirms your suspicions but according to someone who does this day in and day out and is a very reliable source they would opine that they are All "secretarials" except for the Bacall. Didn't include the Heston as we already know that is a classic secretarial.
Never amazes me what these talents must be thinking when having "authorized" signers do their work.
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Mike, well that will just make Chris's day! Some of the "stars" are something. Linda Blair and taking pictures is something to see.
I'll have to get a schray in-person Bacall's up here. I know, I know I keep saying that...
here are a few from a recent R&R and we can draw our own conclusion;
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