Comment by Josh Board on April 14, 2015 at 11:29pm

I keep getting messages from people that have purchased bogus autographs, in the name of "charity." the most recent person duped, paid $3,000 for a signed Led Zep guitar. Not only does it look fake, but...Jimmy Page hasn't signed a guitar in 20 years, and rarely signs autographs of any kind. Here's the photo: 

Comment by Dan Parker on November 2, 2015 at 10:21am

Anyone have knowledge of All Star Enterprises in Georgia - http://allstarenterprises.biz/

Prices seem very low for some great musicians guitars.

Comment by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on November 2, 2015 at 10:49am

There's a good reason their prices are so low. 

Most of their photos are too small to get a good look at the autographs (another key sign to watch out for) but I found this Bruce Springsteen guitar on their site that they apparently forgot to resize. Maybe you'll get some opinions on it:. Click for a large version:

Comment by Josh Board on November 3, 2015 at 10:06am

Guys, if we can...let's keep this thread to be about ANTHONY NURSE and various "charity auction" autograph sites. Otherwise, it just becomes about all the dealers (and there are many), that sell bad stuff. Thanks.

Comment by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on November 3, 2015 at 10:22am

Sorry Josh...will do.

Comment by Josh Board on November 13, 2015 at 10:34pm

Well, GREAT NEWS! A woman with a charity contacted me, with concerns. She had talked to the charity and read this thread. I told her...very simple. Tell them you want photos with the celebs holding the items they signed for this charity. She went a step further, and asked for photos of the items they'd provide. They balked at that, and that's when she smelled a rat. She figured, if they don't feel comfortable enough to send photos, it's probably bogus. She dodged a bullet.

Another guy contacted me. He bought a few items. He then was given a refund, and here's the email exchange that took place (he brings up VERY VERY good points, about how these charities continually get signed Abbey Road albums and Rolling Stones guitars). Charity name withheld, as they did nothing wrong. Have fun reading this:

Josh,

Good news is that it looks like I'll get my money back. I wanted to forward you the response Charity Grows gave to the organization after I notified them that I received forged items. Below is their response, along with my attempted rebuttal. I've redacted the charity's information as I hold them blameless for now.

So glad I found  your thread on autographlive.

Thanks,

Brian

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Brian 
Date: Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 10:12 PM
Subject: Re: Response to Auction Items
To: Adam 

​REDACTED

>

Adam,

Thank you for keeping me informed and for your continued understanding. I only wish I could admit to a case of buyers remorse as Mr. Statman suggests. Quite the opposite as I would love nothing more than to proudly display these items in my home as originally intended. If it was simply remorse, I would turn around and sell the items for a handsome profit as even stand alone McCartney and Starr autographs go for multitudes of what I paid when the memorabilia is authenticated by trustworthy, industry standard authenticators.

I work downtown on Grant street and can meet you almost any weekday downtown, work schedule permitting. I live in Collier Township, so if you live nearby perhaps it is best to meet up in the evening. Let me know what is easiest for you.

With that out of the way, please feel no need to read further. However if you care to jump into the topic or are considering using them for future events, the following is my response to Charity Grow. 

The first thing I would point out is that the Better Business Bureau is not in a position to evaluate whether the items Charity Grow provides are genuine or forgeries. What the BBB can do is to report on whether the business is able and willing to resolve disputes with unsatisfied customers. To their credit, they are ready and willing to issue refunds to customers who recognize that the items they won are fakes. 

Second, I would question the use of the terms "3rd party" and "independent" with regard to the relationship between R&M Real and Charity Grow. That does not mean I am accusing either of anything improper. I merely question the ability of R&M Real to remain impartial when, from what I can tell, a very large part (all?) of their business is predicated on authenticating memorabilia provided by Charity Grow. I've read several testimonies where folks have gone after a true independent authentication for items they have won at charity auctions that have been authenticated by R&M Real (in at least 1 case, the item was an exact duplicate of the Beatles album I won at auction) only to discover that the item was a forgery. Unfortunately (or fortunately depending on whether ignorance is bliss) the vast majority of folks who win these items at auction accept the COA from R&M Real at face value and never realize the item they won is a forgery...at least until they attempt to sell it and realize they need a true independent authentication. It's easy to do a quick search and see who the major auction houses like Christie's use to authenticate this type of memorabilia. Do another quick search on eBay and see what authentications drive the prices of auctions. You won't find R&M Real on either list.

Lastly, it became clear through my research that the ready availability of some of the items that continuously come up for auction at charity events is outside the realm of possibility. For someone who is not a collector, this is not immediately obvious. But, for example, a simple Google search reveals that Ringo Starr famously announced in 2008 that he stopped signing autographs. How is it then that Charity Grows is able to provide a multitude of identical Abbey Road albums signed by both Paul and Ringo? Is it logical that they had these sitting in storage for all these years waiting for opportunity to let them go at a steep discount of $800 a pop? Surely, with the number of these they've put on the market they must have some iron clad proof of the signing session where Ringo and Paul were together. I would be willing to accept a photograph documenting the autograph session that shows them standing with the memorabilia. Again, the Rolling Stones guitar signed by all members of the band that Charity Grows provided for the auction strains belief. How can so many of these identical items be available to charities for auction across the country? Can anyone provide evidence of the session where all Rolling Stones members were together signing this memorabilia? Or should we believe that each member was chased down individually across the globe to sign these guitars? The same thing goes for the Star Wars poster with multiple signatures. When 3 or 4 of these folks get together it becomes a major media event. If the entire lot of them were together to sign autographs I'm sure there would be ample evidence. Upon inspection, the logistics of the matter just don't add up. If Charity Grows can provide proof of these signing events I am very open to reconsidering these points.

I apologize for taking up so much of your time on this matter, but felt the need to respond to Charity Grows well honed response. Doing a deep dive on this really has been an eye opening experience for me. For sure, celebrity memorabilia collecting is a troubled industry full of sharks and charlatans. My hope is that by writing all this, 

​REDACTED

 will at least more closely examine anyone they choose to use in the future.

https://bwufundraising.wordpress.com/2015/02/22/charity-alert-guarding-against-being-scammed-by-charity-auction-item-counterfeiters/

 

Thanks,

Brian 

On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 4:48 PM, 

​REDACTED 

wrote:

Brian,

 

Below is the response I received from our fundraising connection at Charity Grow. We will proceed however you would like and definitely honor a full refund as I want you to be satisfied with the items. That being said I did not find anything negative on the Better Business Bureau website but I have a call with them on Monday. Let me know and I can make arrangements to pick up items and refund your payment. Thanks and again I apologize.

 

Thanks,

 

Adam

 

 

Dear Adam,

 

Per your request, below you will find my response to your concerned bidder. If you or your bidder would like additional insight into the forensic examination process employed by our third-party authenticator, R&M Real, I'd be more than happy to introduce you to the company's president, Detective Michael Ciravolo.

 

To your bidder's concerns...

•              With regard to R&M Real's reputation, in the real world of forensic questioned document analysis, Detective Lieutenant Michael N. Ciravolo is a leader in his field, boasting not just a spotless record, but an exemplary record of accuracy in his examinations, as well as law enforcement excellence. Detective Ciravolo has enjoyed a 40-year career, most of which was spent as a decorated member of the NYPD; a Lieutenant and Commanding Officer who supervised countless investigations into crimes involving forgeries. Today, as the president and chief forensic questioned document examiner for R&M Real, Detective Ciravolo is an active member of The National Association of Document Examiners (NADE), The American College of Forensic Examiners Institute (ACFEI), The International Graphoanalysis Society (IGAS), The American Association of Handwriting Analysts (AAHA) and The Manuscript Society. R&M Real is a genuinely independent third-party authentication firm that does not engage in the buying or selling of autographed collectibles. Their sole interest is examining handwriting and signatures to determine an item's authenticity.

•              Furthermore regarding R&M Real's authentication process, all signatures are forensically examined in person — not by computer scan, as is done by many others in the collectibles industry. Items only receive an R&M Real Certificate of Authenticity after a thorough examination, and all Certificates are downloaded into R&M Real's database, where customers can look up their specific items by unique hologram identification numbers, verifying the items' authenticity in R&M Real's online registry. I invite you to learn more about both R&M Real and their authentication process at http://rmreal.com/.

•              As to Charity Grow's reputation, the online community that refers to itself as "Autograph Magazine" (despite not actually publishing a magazine at all) is a community run by and primarily contributed to by Charity Grow's direct competitors. Their so-called "experts" (none of whom have achieved anywhere remotely near the credentials Detective Ciravolo has earned over his decades of experience in the field) have targeted our company and several others in many ways. This includes working with some deeply misguided and uninformed producers at the tabloid gossip show "Inside Edition." After nearly 10 years of supporting charities all across North America, our reputation with the Better Business Bureau is spotless and our charity partners come back to us year after year because we do an outstanding job providing high quality auction items and experience packages to every organization we support. The reason our reputation with the BBB and our customers is so stellar is because we don't have a customer problem — we have a competitor problem. This is where falsehoods like those referenced by your bidder have arisen.

•              Charity Grow vetted many, many companies before ultimately deciding to entrust our reputation and the reputations of our charity partners with R&M Real. Your winning bidder in his email stated: "Here’s another link to an on-going forum discussion with contributions from several of the most respected persons in the authentication industry that is a fascinating and revealing read on this scam." Who your winning bidder refers to as the "most respected persons in the authentication industry" are memorabilia dealers themselves, and have no way to act impartially. One of the most critical requirements their authentification failed to meet was that they be genuine third-party authenticators, since these authenticators are memorabilia dealers themselves, and therefore do not meet the standards of objective expertise and impartiality we required. I invite you to click on the link below for just a small sampling of the articles we found speaking to many of these specific individuals lack of credibility as viable third party authenticators: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/2afnhiiibctskfv/AABHtOh27idwUJOSaTWBcsHr...

•              All that said, Charity Grow does offer a 100% money-back guarantee on all our pieces of autographed memorabilia. Ultimately, if your bidder is dissatisfied with the quality of the item won at your event, we will honor our guarantee and refund his money in full, no questions asked. Please note, however, that our willingness to openly offer full refunds to any and all bidders who have won our items is in no way an affirmation of negative opinions regarding an item's authenticity. We accept that some bidders suffer buyer's remorse after making substantial auction bids, and we will honor our policy regardless, but so we are entirely clear, the item in question is 100% authentic and if returned will be offered to help another organization fundraise at a future event.

I hope this information helps address some of the concerns you expressed in your bidder's e-mail. As I said, I'm happy to introduce you to Detective Ciravolo if that would help to clear this up.

 

Best,

Marc

 

 

Marc Statman

Charity Grow | Charity Fundraising Specialist

o: (888) 232-2500, ext. 3 | c: 917-239-2835

e: marcs@charitygrow.com | w: charitygrow.com

Comment by Josh Board on November 17, 2015 at 5:07pm

Here are the photos of the items: 

Comment by Susan Thames on January 27, 2016 at 6:40pm

This is the thing about collecting autographs that is so disheartening! I enjoy it as a hobby,but these autographs can get pretty pricey and being duped by these forger/fakers really leaves one feeling burned! I love this post though,ty for helping expose the crooks! =]

Comment by Josh Board on October 18, 2016 at 3:01pm

I was just contacted by another person. He bought a Ronald Reagan "signed" photo from a charity, that had acquired it from Charity Fundraising. Here's the photo (at least you can contact the charity, and get your money back...even if they're screwed by the Charity Fundraising BS company...which I'm told, no longer even has their website up)

Comment by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on October 18, 2016 at 3:36pm

They don't???

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