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Authenticity is Everything
Bob Dylan AUTOPEN Info To Help With Returns / Refunds - Simon & Schuster, Premiere, and Coles
***URGENT UPDATE
Previous update
Some users have uncovered potential autopen use within Bob Dylan's expensive art prints. Please check your prints if you own one and post a picture on this thread if you have any concerns.
here is a link to one of his art prints in question
https://www.castlefineart.com/art/bob-dylan/cactus
*UPDATE - Let this be a warning to ALL publishers and celebrities in the future. We are sick and tired of these autopen releases. Our community has had enough and absolutely will not stand for this practice to continue any longer!!!
I want to point out that Coles Books needs to be commended. They made sure to look out for their customers and refused to ship these out if they came from the same S&S stock, which they did. It was also an easy process to cancel orders beforehand if you wished. Coles. on behalf of everyone, I want to thank you for having integrity and watching out for all of us.
I can NOT say the same about Premiere Collectibles. They refused to honor cancelation requests until it was known these books were in fact autopenned. They advertise themselves claiming they are collectors themselves. This is not true. They are a retailer first and only care about your money. There have been other autopen incidents where they absolutely refused to accept blame, stating items were real when they were clearly deemed autopen by the community. Be careful with future purchases with Premiere Collectibles.
This email came directly from Jonathan Karp at Simon and Schuster. If anyone still wishes to send him a message, here is his email address as well.
jonathan.karp@simonandschuster.com
We apologize for the mistake that was made and are offering a full refund of your purchase. Please keep your copy of The Philosophy of Modern Song at no cost. We hope you will enjoy reading it.
Sincerely,
Jonathan Karp
Here are 51 articles and counting detailing our combined efforts on this forum
New York Post - Screenshot.jpg
New York Times - Screenshot.jpg
Los Angeles Times - Screenshot.jpg
Washington Post - Screenshot.jpg
Rolling Stone - Screenshot.jpg
Rolling Stone pt2 - Screenshot.jpg
Billboard pt2 - Screenshot.jpg
The Daily Beast - Screenshot.jpg
Ultimate Classic Rock - Screenshot.jpg
Poetic Justice - Screenshot.jpg
The Music Universe - Screenshot.jpg
I Heart Radio - Screenshot.jpg
Publishers Lunch - Subscription required
Spiegel - Translated Screenshot.jpg
Far Out Magazine - Screenshot.jpg
American Songwriter - Screenshot.jpg
American Top 40 - Screenshot.jpg
We Got This Covered - Screenshot.jpg
Healthcare Buisness - Screenshot.jpg
Sydney Morning Herald - Screenshot.jpg
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ORIGINAL POST
I am creating this thread as a comprehensive all in 1 link for returns, refunds, chargebacks and claims made regarding the "signed" edition of Bob Dylan - The Philosophy Of Modern Song. Please use this link to email Simon & Schuster, Coles, and Premiere Collectables as 100% proof these were signed using an autopen machine.
I would like to say right off the bat, Coles Books in the UK is handling this professionally and seem to care deeply about their customer base. They have stated that, once they are in hand, If they find evidence of them being autopenned, they will cancel all orders.. Kudos to Coles.. I wish all retailers would follow their lead. If you wish to cancel your order with them immediately instead of waiting, It seems to be an easy process.
This post will be continuously updated with new information over the next few days
Please refer to this article for the time being until more information is added
https://www.iheartradio.ca/newstalk-1290-cjbk/news/collectors-quest...
Here is the post I created a few weeks ago with info regarding the Indigo incident.
https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/indigo-bob-dylan-po...
So far, there have been a total of 17 confirmed different templates for the autopen machine used for Bob Dylans signature. I am in the process of creating video comparisons for all 17 sets. Please post full page photos of your item as they are delivered to aid in this process
Here are all 17 templates used by Bob Dylan - I am still looking for full page photos for numbers 8,13 and 15 thru 17 but its still best to post whatever you receive
Be aware when checking against your own copy, it has come to light that they are possibly using 1st and last names interchangeably. Bob in #2 matches perfectly with Bob in #13 while Dylan in both are different
14th variation confirmed
15th variation
16th variation - Seems to be almost an exact combination of #11 and #13 with a different vertical line in his "D"
17th variation
Video and photo comparisons created so far
Video of set 1 Dylan1.mp4 - Photo of set 1 Dylan1.JPG
Video of set 2 Dylan2.mp4 - Photo of set 2 Dylan2.JPG
Video of set 3 Dylan3.mp4 - Photo of set 3 Dylan3.JPG
Video of set 4 Dylan4.mp4 - Photo of set 4 Dylan4.JPG
Video of set 5 Dylan5.mp4 - Photo of set 5 Dylan5.JPG
Video of set 6 Dylan6.mp4 - Photo of set 6 Dylan6.JPG
Video of set 7 Dylan7.mp4 - Photo of set 7 Dylan7.JPG
Video of set 9 Dylan9.mp4 - Photo of set 9 Dylan9.JPG
Video of set 10 Dylan10.mp4 - Photo of set 10 Dylan10.JPG
Video of set 11 Dylan11.mp4 - Photo of set 11 Dylan11.JPG
Video of set 12 Dylan12.mp4 - Photo of set 12 Dylan12.JPG
Video of set 14 Dylan14.mp4 - Photo of set 14 Dylan14.JPG
Here are the COAs stating these books were in fact hand-signed
Suzanne Baboneau for UK - Certificate Of Authenticity UK.jpg
Jonathan Karp for USA - Certificate Of Authenticity USA.JPG
Coles listing before it was removed - Coles Website Listing.jpg
Important emails:
Jonathan Karp US - CEO of Simon & Schuster
jonathan.karp@simonandschuster.com
Duane Ward of Premiere Collectables
duane@premierespeakers.com - Others have tried duane@premierecollectables.com
Suzanne Baboneau, Managing Director
suzanne.baboneau@simonandschuster.co.uk
Ian Chapman, UK - CEO
ian.chapman@simonandschuster.co.uk
Bob Dylan's Manager
Jeff Kramer
OK Management
275 South Beverly Drive
Suite 215
Beverly Hills, CA 90212
Phone: 310-535-1647
Bob Dylan's Agent
Brian Greenbaum
Creative Artists Agency
2000 Avenue Of The Stars
Los Angeles, CA 90067
Phone: 424-288-2000
Bob Dylan's Production Agent
Sony/Columbia/CBS Records
550 Madison Avenue
New York, NY 10022
Phone: 212-833-7305
Bob Dylan's Law Firm
Manatt Phelps & Phillips
11355 West Olympic Boulevard
Los Angeles, CA 90064
Phone: 310-312-4000
Bob Dylan's Twitter
Tweet or privatly message Bob on his verified Twitter account.
https://twitter.com/bobdylan/
Bob Dylan's Facebook
Post or message Bob on his verified Facebook.
https://www.facebook.com/bobdylan/
I also found this email associated with Bob Dylans store. Its worth a try
BOBDYLAN@EPICRIGHTS.COM
Media Publications who may be eager to pick up this story - Please email them a link to this post and all related content
https://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/corp/contactus.html
For story pitches, please send:
News to Jim Milliot and John Maher
Soapbox ideas to Rachel Deahl
Features to features@publishersweekly.com
Related content:
Dolly Parton is also guilty of using multiple autopens in the same fashion with multiple templates over the years but with a slight twist where they manipulate the page as the autopen machine writes her signature. If we are looking to stop all future attempts at autopen usage, she needs to be held accountable just as much as Bob Dylan and S&S. Link to threads below
Here is a great example provided by Eric Keith Longo
Dolly Parton Autopen Example.jpg
http://www.feelnumb.com/2022/03/09/dolly-parton-fake-autograph-song...
https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/dolly-parton-signed...
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by PFCollector on
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Once again not saying you're right or wrong... Sure theres no proof the ones before 2020 are fake, but there's also no proof they're 100% real either. The only ones who would know for sure are Bob and his team and they can't be trusted.
We can compare signatures, but hand signed signatures aren't as easy to spot as being fake as autopen. Especially with someone who refuses to sign in person 99% of the time. He could have had someone signing for him for many years on his official stuff so people assume its real since he rarely signs in person. Is that improbable? Maybe... but theres no way of knowing 100% for anyone that wasn't in the room watching him sign... and I haven't seen any of those people provide irrefutable proof beyond their word, which means nothing.
They can be compared to known real examples, but there's been plenty of times when autograph "experts" have gotten things blatantly wrong, and it was later figured out when things more scrutinized. So yes, there's no proof they're fake before 2020, but we've also been given zero proof they're all real. Besides the people making money off them (aka known liars who are willing to sell fakes as real) saying they are real. Anyone can say they're real, just like anyone can say they're fake. Until something can be proven then it can always be questioned.
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Permalink Reply by Nichole on
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The experts got every one of them wrong. I’ve got the gosh damn date wrong.
we are all wrong. Epperson is wrong. Ok. You’re right.look i helped you get your database. This whole mess is terrible. I for one won’t buy his signed crap again. I do trust the stuff I have but I’ll share my 10 sigs for a database.
He signed in 2020 before march. You’ll see.
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I think you're the only one that needs to learn to read. I literally said multiple times I'm not saying you're right or wrong. What I am saying is for whatever reason you think everyone should believe you when you say, they're all real, I know but mysteriously can't tell you why, or show any proof. But you keep bringing up the fact nobody has given proof they're fake... and as I said, yes that's true. Nobody has proven they're fake, just like nobody has proven them to be real... but for whatever reason you expect everyone to believe your side with no proof, and not the other.
So once again in case you didn't understand... I'm not saying they're real or fake. I'm saying believing they're real without proof is the same as believing they're fake without proof.
If you claim to know for a fact they're real and can't say why that would make me assume you have some insider knowledge. Without proof of that knowledge why would anyone believe what you say? You want proof from everyone else but refuse to provide any for what you say. So just as much as you can say you KNOW they're real, anyone else can say they KNOW they're fake. It's all the same bs until someone proves their side of the story.
And you want to act like I'm so far off base for saying people can get things wrong... So far Castle Galleries has been wrong, Simon and Schuster has been wrong, Dylan has been wrong... the people with the most insider knowledge possible have all been wrong... but you think everyone should believe you with no proof. Lol
I appreciate your help in figuring out the autopens, and trust me I was ready to give up on the hobby after the Indigo situation, it's been frustrating for everyone... but you can't just say something is real with no proof and expect everyone to take it as gospel, especially after all the bs Dylan and his team and everyone who planned to make money off this has pulled... then criticize those who said its possible they're fake... and then say to ask Castle Galleries who's lied plenty for their word on the matter, like they should be believed about anything. That makes zero sense.
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I didn’t criticize people. Did you NOT read the bull on the other page accusing me of being someone other than me or having some other motive for being here???? Yeah I’m pretty pissed off after working on getting all this stuff straight through a weekend on a phone when I have a gosh damn disability where excessive computer use hurts my syndrome. Yeah. I’m annoyed. my intentions were straight forward. I’m not a liar or a fraud.
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Folks, if you haven't already, then Google Bob Dylan autopen - it's everywhere - NY Times, Daily Mail etc. Well done all who helped make that happen. He has been well and truly shamed and caught with his pants around his ankles. It should seriously make every future artist think twice about doing this and calls into question his integrity going forward. He's probably too rich and old to care much but if it stops even one other major artist trying to scam their fans then it's a job well done. Personally, they could send me a hand written letter of apology from Bob now and I wouldn't believe it was real.
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Have any of those stories been updated about the prints? I Googled it and mostly just seen the book stories from the past few days.
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Well Done Jason and All.
My initial thoughts as i'm waking up are deep down disbelief as I like many of us (but not all) would think Bob and his team would stoop so low as to not only sign autopenned books but his prints aswell.
If you have vertigo that bad to sign - then you sure as hell cannot stand on stage and sing for hours on end - so that's bull s*** first off!
Bob and his team have committed blatant fraud. Just because he has come out and admitted it - does not make it alright and acceptable. He has only put out that statement for damage limitation, well Bob the damage has been done, you started it with autopenning your prints years ago and as you seemingly got away with it, continued to show a total disregard for your fans and continued the use of the autopen, now you have been found out you are trying to make excuses for your fraudulant and deceptive actions, I for one don't believe a word of it.
I think everybody that bought an autopenned Print or book need to open a lawsuit against him, unless he puts this right by some sort of huge gesture - maybe he should run a Bob Dylan - the US / European Autopeen / Autopreent Tour 2023 - and the name of the band? Bob Dylan and the Simon & Schuster Shitheads ..... where each and everyone get to meet him and are hand given a signed book or print in person !
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Wow, what a lame statement. So he hasn’t signed anything since early 2020? I would be really upset if I acquired one of those artprints recently.
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