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Musician Direct Autograph Sales Forum and pre-orders. Resellers, FOMO Taking Over, Marketing Tactics Threatening to Collectors? Maybe I Need A Break
I've been an autograph collector in general for 33 years starting when I was 11. Found out about Newbury Comics in my 20s and have only been a regular here at Autograph Magazine for the last 4 years. I've taken a few long term breaks in my life, Mostly from taking up new hobbies, being too busy, or just realizations that in reality, these people are no better than I am. They are just on a different path. (Mostly)
Anyways, it's starting to feel different now. There has always been side talk of this hobby becoming the equivalent to collecting sports cards in the 90s but I never let it bother me. I've taken up vinyl collecting as a hobby and have seen 1st hand how they play the market. They use FOMO with limited releases, but in reality, they just stagger releases without really being limited, aside from the moment, in order to sell to 4 different markets. Music lovers, Collectors, resellers, and the FOMO crowd. If they did not stagger releases with limited stock each, they would start to lose some buyers. Not "limited" at all and they would be completely out of 3 of these 4 markets.
Over the last 4 years, I feel autograph pre-orders have been slowly evolving to the same concept. Preorders have become a huge part of sales on ebay starting at high prices to cater to the FOMO crowd. Resellers take these items out of collectors hands. Autographs are now being released in large quantities to cater to everyone. Once the album is released, ebay is flooded, prices decline fast and collectors are sometimes shocked to see how many have actually been released.
I've never been a reseller but I have watched the market for the last 3 years since starting a collection for my 3yr old daughter. Im concerned about them being a long term investment for her. Not long ago, I purchased a few Bernie Taupins to go with our Elton autographs thinking they will pair well as an investment for her. Then Taupin releases thousands of signed books into the market which caused a bit of regret on my previous purchase since I could have used these books as cuts and been much happier at a fraction of the cost.
I guess it all comes down to why each of us collects. Since autograph releases are so common these days. I think its taking away from the fun of being a collector. The marketing tactics used for Vinyl have made me stop collecting records completely unless they are autographed. Now the same marketing tactics are starting to affect the way I view autographs as a hobby. Maybe it's time I took another break. Take some time to re evaluate why autographs are important to me.
Just thought I'd share a bit how I'm feeling lately
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Yony Mark on
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"Im concerned about them being a long term investment for her."
I'm not sure what you mean here.
If you're concerned about autograph collecting going the way of vinyl records, then you're part of the problem. Vinyl record collecting has become bad because of scalpers who buy 20 copies of the same album for "investment". That's one of the main reasons I quit collecting vinyl records after a short while.
If you're concerned about autograph collecting not being a "profitable investment", well, I don't regret to tell you that that's just life. The more autographs artists sign, the more there is for fans and collectors.
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Permalink Reply by Jason H on
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Concern about being an investment for my daughter is secondary. More like a fallback if she doesn't have interest. She is just about to turn 4. Maybe its a mistake to drag her into this hobby especially since she will inherent my collection in the end anyways. My thinking was to inspire her while she grows up though and that can't be a bad thing, but that is a who other conversation in itself.
I don't see how I am part of the problem of vinyl collecting based on how I feel. I still own my collection, all opened and all are in rotation of being played. I just don't buy them anymore unless they are autographed.
The "scalpers" you mention I believe are a byproduct of the marketing schemes but also combined with the side hussle mentality fad of today. I personally have not sold 1 autograph in over a decade. I did sell off my sports collection mixed with a few others a long time ago to help pay for college but it was because I met my wife and lost interest in sports completely. Although I did add some extras in with them which led to nothing but regrets. Im still searching to replace those extras I sold and its a big reason I regained my drive for this hobby again 4 years ago. Will I sell again in the future? I have no idea. I learned my lesson about letting things go but these days, it doesn't seem like I'd have the same problem. Most of the releases lately will be in circulation forever because of the quantities released.
My post is directed specifically to the direct autograph sales thread, mostly preorders and how it affects the hobby in general. Right now, I couldn't care less about the money for myself. It does however irk me when I spend time, money and effort hunting down specific autographs and a year later the same person ends up releasing a few thousand, flooding the market. It feels like I wasted a part of my life.
Overall, I love the items I have in my collection. I plan to keep what I have now until the day I die, but maybe I'm realizing its just not worth the effort anymore. Theres something about collecting today thats losing its fun for me. Maybe its my own problem. Maybe I'm winding down and am satisfied with what I already have and just don't need anymore. Or maybe I have some anxieties over my daughters collection which affects my view overall. It could be a combination of them all. As a long time collector though I can't help but notice a difference to this hobby over the years. I think I let the marketing tactics take over a bit and now realizing I care more about quality over quantity. Its probably best I step back.
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I can't make sense of the various points you've mentioned... you're talking about lots of different things.
What's the problem with artists releasing autographs to the market? Like, even if you've hunted down for a specific item, you have a story associated with it, etc. It's like catching a guitar pick at a show vs buying it off eBay / the artist's official website. It could be the same pick but the story is what makes it different and worthwhile.
Sure, the hobby is changing, along with the whole world. I feel like it's becoming a bit more mainstream, and I think it's better that way. Why?
1. More artists are likely to release autographs.
2. More people to talk to about collecting autographs.
3. More help and awareness in avoiding the various foregries in the second-hand market.
By the way, showing your hobbies to your kids is really cool. If I would have kids in the future, I'd definitely show them my musical interests. Don't know if I would show them my collection though.
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You are right in your points and it is a lot of things combined making me feel this way. Maybe its just personal for me and I still need time to reset. I've had a long 2023 with multiple surgeries. Stuck at home recovering. Had probably my biggest year ever collecting and now a bit overwhelmed because I have a lot left to organize. I just had a foot cast removed and am starting to walk again but 2 weeks away from not using crutches anymore. Its all piled up. I've finally started to go thru the ones I've collected in the last few months to organize and put away with my collection. In general, I see a lot of quick scribbles instead of autographs. Quality in the hobby has taken a hit. I think im just frustrated at the moment and needed to voice some stuff to get it off my chest.
I do agree with what you are saying. Also, thanks, I can't wait until my daughter is old enough to understand her collection. How you said you are not sure if you would let your kids see your collection is another reason I decided to start her own. It may backfire though but I thought Its a way to keep my collection secret but still share my experiences
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Permalink Reply by Rich on
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I get it, as I periodically have to re-evaluate what I'm getting and why I'm getting it. Looking back, there were definitely ones I didn't really need to buy and perhaps others I should have (or should have hung onto). Defining and re-defining what you want to collect (genres, media types, etc) can help. A good rule of thumb might be to stick with artists you like as opposed to "this might be worth something," unless you're sure about the latter or the art's magnitude to too big too ignore. While there have been some disappointments in terms of quality (and occasionally authenticity), you have to admit there have been some pretty great ones too. Are they less special that something you got yourself on something unique or something sent specifically to you? Of course. but thinking back a few years to some of those amazing releases and occasionally high quality items at minimal prices (think the Florence + The Machine Posters for $15, Dua Lipa perfectly signed vinyl for less than $20, etc).
Regarding getting stuff for your daughter, I think I'm kind of in the same boat as you in terms of my own age and my daughter's. I haven't really thought in terms of financial investments at all, as there are definitely more sound - and less cumbersome - investment avenues to suit those types of needs. I have gotten a dozen or so things personalized for her over the first few years of her life (in person, TTM and through some preorders - namely Banquet), but even early on I've second guessed whether she'll actually like any of this stuff. Or even if some of these artists might fall into complete obscurity by her teenage years. On that subject, just when she starts hitting the point when music *might* be on her radar, some of the artists that were in their twenties when I got them will be in their late thirties and forties. Will these even be artists she likes? Some might be, as a few of them are continuing to head toward bigger things. But I'd think she'd probably be more interested in younger artists who, right now, are probably kids themselves. On the whole, I've tended to tilt back toward doing this for my own enjoyment.
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Thanks for this. I really should be more grateful and look at things a bit different. All of the duds I bought lately were returned for a refund after some complaining. Also got some free stuff out of it, 2 Ice T vinyl for example. The only thing I messed up on was forgetting I had preorders overseas for millie bobby brown. It didn't make sense to return once they arrived and I left it alone without a fight.
You're right though. I've been buying autographs which I have no emotional connection to and that may be causing me to see this hobby differently. Im not a fan of Millie Bobby Brown, Ice T, Nicki Minage, etc..., etc... I've been spending too much time with this hobby, collecting with wreckless abandon for a while now and I think its catching up with me mentally. Maybe I'm also using my daughter as an excuse as well without even realizing. Its definitely time for a reboot and think things over
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Oohhhh, now I understand what you're talking about, especially after @Rich shared his experience as well.
For me 2023 also wasn't easy. I started the year with unemployment, since the tech sector has been undergoing massive layoffs. It was important for me to find a job which matches my professional goals and specifications, so I took the time to really evaluate the market and look for the right position. It was hard, but it was an amazing year overall. Eventually, I found a job, and I couldn't have done it without the music I've listened to, the concerts and various social events I went to in my spare time, and of course the amazing amount of autographs and concert memorabilia that I've obtained thanks to this forum.
That being said, I do think that I could've skipped some of the stuff I bought. I don't have enough time to listen to ALL of my physical collection, including so many signed CDs by bands that are new to me. This year I'm trying not to spend as much as I did last year and the year before. It's still hard though :)
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Really glad things came together for you last year! Thats a nice story. Once money starts rolling in and we have disposable income, i think its hard not to get carried away sometimes. I work from home, on my own schedule which gives me too much freedom while living in a boring rural area for now. Constantly checking sites for new stuff and I guess I might have forgot why I love this hobby along the way somewhere. Almost like its on the edge of becoming a burden instead of being fun. Im an all or nothing type of guy and I know the only way to take a step back is probably to stop monitoring this forum completely for an extended period.
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Thanks :) I'm also happy for you that you are recovering! And yes, it's definitely not easy when money isn't rolling in, so much so that when it does get back rolling in, it's TOO easy to waste it on stuff we don't need.
But like I said earlier, I'm doing my best not to buy too much autographs and stuff this year, as much as I did last year and the year before. I need time to enjoy all the stuff I got so far :)
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Permalink Reply by crazyrabbits23 on
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I'm ambivalent about resellers. I've said this before and I'll say it again - resellers helped me get items I didn't have a hope of getting at release for a semi-reasonable price. The only reason I have that dual-signed Gilmour/Samson photo and associated signed book is because I got it from a flipper on FB Marketplace who wanted $10 above the "retail" price for it. I've been able to get other books that went OOS at launch for semi-reasonable prices. It's not a one-size-fits-all situation.
I may collect for a variety of reasons (one of which is that I treat some of my books as long-term investments), but I'm cognizant of the fact that artists, particularly in the modern age, can and will sign tens of thousands of autographs in their lifetime. What is rare today may be incredibly common a decade from now. The only thing that should matter is how much you're willing to put into buying these items, and whether it brings you joy over the long run. Anything else should be seen as a secondary motive for collecting.
I don't follow much of the direct autograph market. Most of my autographs come from thrift stores. I've been able to amass a sizable collection, with some grail items, for far less than I would have paid if I bought all of them at release or off sites like Abebooks and the like. Yes, I have more capital now to go after items I want, but I have less free time in the day due to other demands and can't/won't deal with wonky websites that crash when pre-orders open, or scummy tactics from direct-to-market retailers.
Don't fall victim to FOMO. There's an entire ocean of opportunity below your feet. Direct online sales from retailers may be bigger business than it was a few years, but it's still only a segment of a much larger market.
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