Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on November 21, 2012 at 6:26am

Jason,

AFTAL has done a lot of good and I think that what you are suggesting makes sense. Having a board of collectors provide input o AFTAL is an excellent idea, but I think that all the members should reside in the UK or Europe. As you could tell from the discussion about the fake Michael Jacksons in the UK, most members of this site don't appreciate what AFTAL and some of its members have done to make autograph collecting safer in the UK. And they have a bad opinion of AFTAL based on the recent fiasco.

Seeing how AFTAL handles the MJ/McCartney issue will tell me if what you're suggesting has a chance of working.

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Permalink Reply by Brandon Mysinger on November 21, 2012 at 10:50am

I think that everyone here is willing and hopeful that a group of honest dealers / collectors can emerge out of the debacle.  A lot of people are waiting to see what is said about the bad items and by whom.

After that, there should be no other way to move than forward.

The good dealers left standing can take the lessons learned by this and use it as the foundation of an updated club.

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Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on November 21, 2012 at 4:18pm

AFTAL will survive the same way that Tylenol did.  They just need a safety cap.  Of course it could be in the form of collectors who opine on AML but I doubt that AFTAL will take them seriously.  There is too much division in this hobby and it is not only an ocean that causes the division.  I really think that what the UK needs is their own version of PSA/DNA.  That would keep AFTAL dealers on their toes.

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Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on November 21, 2012 at 5:05pm

Maybe what they really need is an authentication board, that dealers agree as a company policy to honor the decisions of. It's something I think we need here, but I've gotten flack for suggesting. The board could be international, helping dealers and collectors everywhere.

What do you think?

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Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on November 21, 2012 at 5:13pm

The AB would have too much power and as a result would become corrupt.  Also consider that even PSA and JSA have been known to make mistakes.  If the AB were used independently in the same way that PSA and JSA are used here it would serve the same purpose as I mentioned above and would therefore be fine but I wouldn't give them absolute power.

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Permalink Reply by Paul Fox on November 21, 2012 at 5:08pm

Dont mention a uk version PSA/DNA, youll get threats and a load of abuse making out you know nothing, like i have before. AFTAL believe they are the be all and end all over here, any competition, they hate the thought of it  and try and eliminate it, they pull too many strings in the uk (working relationship with police and trading standards meaning they could also use this kind of power in a bad way to eliminate genuine competition by ganging up) Aftal do not believe there is any room for anyone else on the market but them besides ACAF which i am lead to believe is full of AFTAL anyway.

THis is why im hoping when this statement comes out that Jason Thanos said there will be, im hoping there will be many changes  in a positive way and so i can restore my faith in the uk market, as i have sent items to PSA  to authenticate, where as if AFTAL pulled themselves together, i would have used them and it wouldnt have cost me as much. 

This is my take on things, if you dont agree then fair enough and i am aware there are some good in AFTAL, so dont think i am attacking you.

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Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on November 21, 2012 at 5:20pm

AFTAL will most likely be reconsidering some of their former positions if what Jason is reporting about a change in leadership is true.  Hopefully you will not be attacked for your suggestions in the future.

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Permalink Reply by Jason Thanos on November 21, 2012 at 11:13pm

Guys no one will attack no one we are trying to figure a way forward not create a war .
I personally don't like any authenticating idea it's too much trouble to be tied into Aftal , every authenticator screws up and will screw up this is 100% it's a tough job they have let's not forget it is basically an opinion ,it's like when someone says to me what do you think of this Ronaldo ? I am giving them an opinion which can be then taken as a way of authentication .

I see 100s of fakes everyday that have been authenticated look at that b******* Pacino private signing look at all the substance stuff etc .

I also heard that somewhere in Ohio Michigan there is some geezer that for a right fee does American sport for example it was mentioned in Toronto in sep when I was there , I did not ask as it's not my field but it was out there been said .

I think for me a new board with a teer of people who have good opinions that can take each dealers stock apart And filter it to make sure if there are any bad weeds to pull them out , but the problem is time and money there I guess .

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Permalink Reply by Grant Davis on November 27, 2012 at 1:27am

Hi Jason - where are you today? - any news re AFTAL? - hoping to keep this thread going!

It seems that MJ is as controversial in death as in life!! on both sides of the ocean!!!

 Still jealous of your photo with what's her name!!!!!

kind regards

Grant

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Permalink Reply by Jason Thanos on November 27, 2012 at 4:03am

Hi grant , I believe not long to go having spoken to the aftal board they mentioned its all finalised but they are waiting on a letter from their lawyer so they can release the statement . So hang tight its not to long now hopefully.

Am back in UK done Rome and Madrid back to back and nearly killed me , UK is good for hunting this time of year but water kills the results so its a tough job am in Dont recomend it to no one.

Keep the peace