Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by JK on December 6, 2023 at 8:14am

"Having passed two online authentication exams..."

Are you saying that no one has authenticated this in person?  

Beyond that, I was following this story and I never had any inkling that the identical photo that Eric found online was your listing.  Not until he figured it out for himself.  A lot of wasted effort could have been avoided if that confusion had been cleared up earlier by you.

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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on December 6, 2023 at 8:30am

Thank you JK. 

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Permalink Reply by Patrick Michael Bratcher on December 6, 2023 at 11:31am

I have not found an authentication company that I have a whole lot of trust in.  Look Beckett, JSA, and PSA iup on the BBB website.  They all have F ratings.  Piece of the Past has an A Rating.  When it comes to real authentication, who am I suppose to really trust.  I've  heard and read bad stuff about all of them.

I've been collecting for just under 3 years.  I'll be the first to admit there's a lot I don't know.  I have a lot of autographs that have been certified by the big three.  I also have a least one fake certified by I think it's JSA.

I honestly didn't know I was supposed to tell y'all that I was selling autographs.  I have  lot of big three certified autographs. I have some that are "iffy."  I've been posting some on AutographLive trying to find out which ones of the few I'm not 100% certain about are genuine.   When ACOA say that it passed  the online Authentication am I not suppose to believe what they're telling me.  Honestly, I don't know who really trust with authentications.

I'm not trying to make excuses for not letting y'all know that I'm selling some autographs. i just didn't know  I was suppose to. If that's justification for booted me from the club, well, that's just the way it has to be.  It's not something I want, but it's something I'll have to live with.  But I can say one thing for sure.  Not one of you folks started out knowing what you know now.  I know that I'm trying to do the best I can in the field.  I've made mistakes, not intentionally.  I'll make few more as I learn.  But nothing short of death is gonna deter me from knowing as much as I can autograph collecting and selling.  I love the hobby.  I love the business.  I love the people whose autographs I collect, and yes sell.  I learned more today from Eric's article about authentication than I've learned in the past 3 years.  That  knowledge is very cool and I will learn a lot more before all is said and done.

Thanks.

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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on December 6, 2023 at 11:35am

Thank you. I appreciate those kind comments. Look into what it takes or means to maintain an A rating at BBB. Look into POTP here in our search engine. In any event, may I ask for a scan that shows this to be in black ink? So far none have. Thanks! I am, after all, really here to try and help.

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Permalink Reply by Patrick Michael Bratcher on December 6, 2023 at 11:59am

I wish I could let you see the thing magnified in person.  Under a jeweler's lens. The ink is red. Plus, it's indented where the pen moved across the paper, and the indentation clearly shows varying  amounts of pressure was appied to the pen as it moved across the surface of the photopaper.  Learning this today has been very exciting for me.  I'll see if I can get a super zoom-in photo shot of the autograph.  I'll have to come up with some kind of creative photography.

I own and operate two businesses and do autographs in my spare time, not bad for a 71 year old man.  Anyway, I have to get some invoices figured  and out now so I can pay the guys this week.  I'll get on that when I'm finshed taking care of a little money-making business.

Thanks.

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Permalink Reply by Patrick Michael Bratcher on December 6, 2023 at 1:46pm

I want to get you a really good closeup.

Eric, I apologize.

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Permalink Reply by JK on December 6, 2023 at 11:48am

You're missing or ignoring the whole point.  When Eric told you that he had found the exact same photo as yours elsewhere for sale, instead of telling him that it was yours that he found on ebay, you allowed a prolonged back-and-forth about what that meant for the prospects of yours being authentic.  It was all so unnecessary.

As for which authenticators to believe, PotP is a seller, so of course they will tell you their stuff is real.  They have a very bad reputation among some collectors, but I'll leave it at that.  

The others you mention are Third Party Authenticators, emphasis on "Third Party".  They are only selling their judgement and opinions, not autographs.  They do get it wrong on occassion but a lot of people do generally trust them.

In regard to Quick Opinions (or "online" opinions), they can tell you that the form of the autograph is generally correct, but they can't tell you for sure that it's live ink.  These types of opinions are never considered final or definitive.

In the opinion of a lot of people here, the goal should be to become your own expert, either by gaining the experience yourself, or by developing good resources to consult with (or both).

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Permalink Reply by Patrick Michael Bratcher on December 6, 2023 at 12:09pm

You are right.  I should have said that I had it listed on eBay.  That was my error.  I accept responsibility for not making that known.  I apologize.  I've been up all night working, and frankly, I'm a bit scatterbrained at the moment. I own and operate 2 companies and I do autographs, and collecting other things in my spare time.  Sometimes I'm lucky if I can remember my own name.  Please forgive my absentmindedness.

Thanks.

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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on December 6, 2023 at 1:10pm

Well, yes, very well stated. I agree fully with JK in fact. 100%

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Permalink Reply by Patrick Michael Bratcher on December 6, 2023 at 1:40pm

I would like to learn how to authenticate autographs.  I probably have at least 50 autographed photos that are totL fakes.  I spent a lot of money worthless things.  I'll not get that money back.  I bought them off ebay when I first started  collecting.  I knew nothing.  I thought that eBay monitored the trustworthiness of theirtheir sellers, NOPE!

I slowly learned how to avoid some of the pitfalls of buying from eBay.  I learned about the big three. and started buying certified.  Then I started reading stuff about them, lots of complaints.  But at least I was on a bit smoother road with them.  But I still didn't have full trust in them.  Now, I don't buy anything that doesn't have a sticker. But by now the damage is done.  There are just a few that I'm not 100% certain about.    I read about POP and they sounded pretty good.  Then, I started hearing a lot of stuff about them.

I'll not sell one from the big pile of fakes.  That battle is lost.  No looking back.

I do love collecting autographs of the actors and actresses that have entertained me my whole life.  It just hasn't been as easy or cheap as I thought it would be. 

I gotta admit, I learned a LOT from that article I read today!  That thing opened my eyes to another world!  I like it! I got a small glimpse at the science involved in autograph authentication.  It was exciting and fun. I want to know more.  Anyway, enough of my rambling.

Thanks.

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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on December 6, 2023 at 2:22pm

I will help you as much as I can. Here is are a few of my prized items:

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Permalink Reply by Patrick Michael Bratcher on December 6, 2023 at 3:09pm

I think those are great!  I like Jackie Gleason a lot.  He was a funny man.  I also really like the Vivien Leigh.  Those are very cool!  They're all great!

I sent closeups of the red ink on Gable.  It's red.

Thanks.

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