Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Xwiesy on February 2, 2014 at 9:35am

Trust the signature, not so much the dealer.

Yes, you can see a dealer who sells all forgeries and stay far away. But there are honest people who make mistakes. Let the signature be your guide.

In your case this is a tough one, because we have an example that is not textbook. That is why I would tell any collector to stick to text book examples. That way you are'nt left answering questions when you go to sell it.

My belief is that this example is authentic- the "a" and "g" are spot on. You can go on ebay right now and see signatures that have been authenticated by people we love and respect that share dead on similarities.

Your example is definitely rushed- when examining this type of signature we must remember that there is what the signer intended to do and then there's the way it turned out. Since this turned out a ilittle different than the majority, we're left looking for distinctive marks within the signature that can help us out.

As I said, I like the "a" and "g" as being telltale signs of authenticity.

I was asked to look at this and immediately reviewed about 30 known exemplars and I lean authentic.

These ones that stray are definitely more difficult, and perhaps it's worth $15 to have Mr Epperson look at it.

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Permalink Reply by Xwiesy on February 2, 2014 at 9:55am

To give you an example:

There is a dealer that is getting pummeled on this board as we speak. Accusations, insults...

And yet right now there is an authentic signature on ebay with their certificate.

And for a steal of a price- if someone purchased it, ey could probably submit it to Roger, get his cert and turn around and make some money.

Or that same buyer could just rely on the dealer's reputation and pass up a good deal.

For the most part, let the signature be your guide.

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Permalink Reply by Mike Kaminski on February 2, 2014 at 9:59am

No one

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Permalink Reply by alan david munns on February 2, 2014 at 10:44am

yes your right it is rushed , I asked the dealer as I allways do about the background and it was obtained at lords cricket ground mick being a big cricket fan , ive tried mick there and he s very elusive so it would be a rushed sig

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Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on February 2, 2014 at 11:35am

AFTAL and the UACC Registered Dealer program have some excellent dealers, but they also have a number of dealers who regularly and knowingly deal in forgeries. Several dealers I would avoid like the plague are members of both organizations. Two of them are founders of AFTAL. (Garry King of Autographica is the only founder of AFTAL I trust.)

It's a shame, because AFTAL seemed to do it so right early on.

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Permalink Reply by Rich on February 2, 2014 at 11:50am

I used to errantly consider UACC RD's a safe purchase, but the fact is that there are great dealers and so pretty mediocre ones (at best) in the RD club.  Some dealers just aren't that competent.  As the landscape of the hobby has changed over the past 10 -15 years (more ability for buyers to purchase straight from collectors, more avenues for both authentic material and forgeries, etc), I think that some of these "old school" type dealers might struggle more and more to determine what's good and bad.  

I personally have very short list of signatures I know well enough to make a purchase entirely on my own knowledge.  As far as dealers and sellers go, that list is also short - at least as far as sellers who I can make a completely worry free purchase from with no concerns about authenticity.

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Permalink Reply by alan david munns on February 3, 2014 at 10:43am

not much hope for us collectors then!!

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Permalink Reply by Rich on February 3, 2014 at 11:13am

It depends on how cautious you are.  I narrowed my collecting focus to people I'm actually a big fan of, or good deals from top sources (i.e. promo items from Newberry comics).  I'm more critical of sellers and sources than I used to be, and I generally take a pass if there's any skepticism.  I try to avoid bad examples altogether (unless I get it myself), even if it comes straight from someone with a rock solid reputation.  I'd rather not own anything that I have even marginal concern about.

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Permalink Reply by Ian Baldock on February 3, 2014 at 1:06pm

Im very conservative when it comes to autographs. I figure 75% are forgeries. I wanted a Jagger autograph so I bought a bravado brussels book. Im lucky that I can just overpay to get a reasonably safe signature. There are good deals out there but this "hobby" is full of minefields! Im on the fence with your Jagger because its a bit atypical, I see similiararities but also differences. In which case when cautious I would lean against.

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Permalink Reply by Seleznev Dmitri on February 3, 2014 at 5:45pm

Didn't follow discussion but this is who you trust: if this is a REGISTERED ( not just a "good standing member") of UACC and AFTAL  its pretty much speaks to itself, you can trust. However, even there is a possibility of simple misfortune for many reasons, sometimes no one aware of... Otherwise, like Garry King teaches a 100% guarantee if you obtained autograph yourself and in person (not through the secretary, assistant, etc.). Everything else leaves a shadow of doubt...  Go to www.autograph-market.com and educate yourself, this web site is really fascinating. Particular dealer that you can trust is Markus Brandes. You can find him on brandesautographs.com or autograh-market.com He has a solid reputation and you are not gonna be disappointed. Good luck.

And do yourself a favor: don't buy anymore crap on eBay...

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Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on February 3, 2014 at 8:35pm

Markus is A+. Great site.

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Permalink Reply by Carl Ryan on February 3, 2014 at 9:04pm

I would be very very careful of trusting certified dealers on the basis of being a UACC or AFTAL dealer. I have seen plenty of forgeries being sold by UACC dealers. Mostly from the same ones. Same with AFTAL dealers, although i havent searched through any AFTAL dealers inventory in well over a year. And the AFTAL scandal left a horrid taste in my mouth, so i wont go there. But i would just be careful as some once good dealers go bad, or just have forgeries that are coming in from guys they trust.

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