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Authenticity is Everything
George Harrison real or fake???
A while back I decided to give Mike Frost from P.A.A.S. a chance to authenticate a few of my Beatles autographs. He was significantly cheaper than many of the other authenticators and I had seen his EBay auction a number of times. I decided to send him this mid 70's Harrison autograph which, in my opinion, is pretty cut and dry a genuine autograph. To my disbelief he responded saying that autograph was in fact NOT authentic! Along with this signature I sent him others as well which he deemed as not genuine. I felt terrible knowing that these were real and I was just taken for my money to the tune of $400.00+ dollars. After I received the signatures I did the only thing one could do. I mailed them off to Frank Caiazzo for a true authentication. As expected, the autograph was indeed authentic. I felt a little more vindication when I found out that his authentication services were puled from EBay. BUT! I just ran across another one of his ebay auctions trying to lure unknowing patrons to use his services for Beatles autographs! I was as you can imagine quite peeved. In my opinion, I would stay as far away from a Mike Frost PAAS Beatles authentication as possible. It is my belief that he has no clue what is real and what is not and I would advise to save your money and go with someone more reputable in this business. Take a look at the example for yourself and you be the judge!!!
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Xperttexpert on
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your right roger, my main beef all along is with ebay. why ebay said they would no longer except auto's with paas authentications on their site, which is why i sent the ones he even passed as real for other l.o.a.'s, but still paas is selling them on ebay. what happens if a person trys to sell an auto' with paas authentication and then it gets pulled, and the guy says i got the auto. certificate on ebay. once again i broke my own rule of keeping a low profile. i should have just let it go and let the chips fall where they may.
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Permalink Reply by DB on
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Unless, something has gone on lately, I don't believe the auto-removal of PAAS COAs is still in effect (haven't checked lately but when last I did there were several that ran their course). I believe, and anyone can correct me, that the PAAS COAs as a result were significantly changed in an attempt to eliminate any "pilfering" that might have gone on.
@Roger - I believe Mike was addressing in his viewpoint some exaggerated claims, regardless of reason, that were made early on regarding how many were authenticated by Caiazzo & the PAAS Cost expended.
From what I have read there were six others and it's quite foggy as to what was authenticated/rejected/repudiated and by whom.
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Permalink Reply by terrier8HOF on
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PAAS is not on Ebay's banned list
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That is correct but "systematic removal" of COAs don't always have to be on the banned list. When they entered that grey area there is time to address & appeal. Failing that there is a good possibility where the COAs would be headed. Mike has explained several of the reasonings below.
@Steve - Prior ones are still not allowed, but eBay isn't equipped to automatically police them. which I don't understand as they did previously and still do others from my understanding. Granted, a few still get by but with favorable winds get picked off. If you look currently one will see several older PAAS ones as well as a some new ones with a new one on a Michael Jackson.
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Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on
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DB,
eBay runs an automated search for words and acronyms identifying authenticators that aren't allowed on eBay. It can't tell an old PAAS from a new one, so they've probably stopped running it on PAAS, or old and new would get flagged.
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Am aware of what is suppose to happen with the search. They seem to be falling down on alot of things as of late. If they can't handle and research less than 19 items then it is merely a signal of things to come. That would not be in the positive.
are you sure "older" PAAS Items are not allowed? If so, by whom?
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When eBay told me they were allowing PAAS certifications again they said it was only for new authentications, with COAs and LOAs that looked different than PAAS's old ones.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Frost on
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Roger ,
Thank you for your input and your opinion of this George Harrison autograph. I do understand the hatred, and when Steve Cyrkin invited me to join Autograph Magazine Live, he explained what I was going to have to deal with. I can deal with it, and I understand the problems I have caused for both you and Steve in the past. I said I would make myself available to the site for questions and to show examples and information from the side of a third party authenticator. I am proud to be here and I have taken my share of abuse from members of the so called other side. I no longer were a colored hat and I am only looking out for what I believe is best for this hobby. I will be helping you and anyone else that truly want to expose forgery and corruption within the autograph industry without hidden agenda's. As George Harrison himself said "All Things Must Pass"
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Mike,
I certainly appreciate your willingness to participate in the discussions on this site. your input is greatly valued.
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Permalink Reply by Carl Ryan on
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Then why did you call for the "death" of Steve Cyrkin when your items were removed by ebay. So much so that Steve had to file charges with the police dept. If this were just a matter of a few problems that needed to be taken care of on ebay, then why did Cyrkins name and his "death" come into play at all. It seems pretty obvious what went on their and why his "death" was called for by you.
Its just like the concept of "cheating" with a girl. I found out long ago, as most of us have, that once someone cheats, guy or girl, they will do it again. It matters not if they get married, if they claim they have changed their ways, or if they find the person of their dreams. If the right person comes along or the right opportunity they will cheat again. And the only reason for proclaiming that they are a new man and wont ever do it again, is that it serves their purpose at the time and is good for business so to speak. That is exactly how i see this situation.
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Carl Ryan,
I am sorry about how you feel and that you may have been cheated on or disappointed by a loved one. I have never heard from you before and I have never heard your name before. I assume you are one of the people I would never win over and you already know everything. That is fine you are entitled to you own opinion and you can believe in what ever you please. I would like to say I feel sorry for you if you do not believe that people can make mistakes. I also feel sorry for you do not believe that people can change or see the light. The world and most religions are based upon forgiveness, I am one that would like to see proof and actions before forgiveness but I think it is important to forgive even if you do not forget. ( Just my opinion and the way I was brought up)
I also see how far things can be taken out of context or how a little spin can change the interpretation of a statement. I am sure you noticed that over the past year with our presidential campaigns.
I have never physically called for the death of anyone, there was no physical threats nor any acts of violence wished upon Steve. You can read into the statement anything you wish, I admit it was wrong and I am sorry it was every said but it was said and I have to deal with that.
Why do you believe or who told you that this statement or editorial had anything to do with ebay? This is a spin that can make a whole different definition of what was said and the way it was meant to be taken.
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Mike,
Sorry, but I have to side with Carl Ryan on his one. The day I published PAAS Certified Autographs Removed From eBay is the day you published the post below on ANL:
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