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eBay tells me...."They allow forgeries" I'm NOT JOKING GUYS.

I brought up eBay seller: this-n-thatsportscollectiblesplusmore the other day and after going through his account and calculating how much money he has made on forgeries, I decided to call eBay yesterday. After being transferred around, I finally get a hold of someone in (Fraud Resolution) and this person seemed to have knowledge of autographs.

At any rate, I firstly explained my frustration with eBay allowing forgeries to constantly be sold on their site and how it seems that eBay has a serious lack of concern in relation to the problem of forgeries being sold on their site.

HIS RESPONSE: The Fraud Department does its very best to weed out easily identifiable forgeries and those of higher valued items by using Third Party Authenticators to look at items that have been reported. However, it is the buyers responsibility to do their own research before bidding

I then asked why Global Authentication is still an eBay approved authenticator with their reputation of authenticating thousands and thousands of forgeries on a monthly basis.

HIS RESPONSE: I will have to defer on that question because I don't have an answer for you. I will pass that comment along to the fraud department.

I then brought up seller this-n-thatsportscollectiblesplusmore who has sold over 250,000 $$$ dollars in forgeries all authenticated by Global Authentication. I explained that I go in weekly to report his items, yet they never get removed.

HIS RESPONSE: In order for an item to be removed it must be reported by multiple eBay users.

SO AFTER THIS WHOLE CONVERSATION, I feel that eBay is very passive on forgeries. Based on this conversation, it honestly seemed to me that they don't give a rats tail if people sell forgeries.

LET'S DO THIS...GO TO this-n-thatsportscollectiblesplusmore and report every item you think is fake. Let's just see if we all report if eBay will do anything about him. He has sold over 1,000 Tom Brady signed Helmets and Footballs and I have reported EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM. By myself NONE OF THEM HAVE EVER BEEN REMOVED. Let us see if as a team, we can get action. So go look at the autographs you feel are fake and report them. Will it get a response out of ebay?

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Permalink Reply by Carl Ryan on October 30, 2014 at 10:20pm

Yeah i read that Jason, lol. And my post wasnt for you, sorry if it sounded like it was, it was for the collector of antique forgeries. Maybe there is a market for antique forgeries. I mean i suppose you still have to be skilled to forge a piece of art. But that relates nothing to autographs. A forgery has zero value. The closest an autograph forgery could come to having value is like a clubhouse signature on a ball, or like the beatles manager signing for them. And those arent even forgeries, so to speak. So i have no idea what the point of that post was?? That we should value our forgeries? lol

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Permalink Reply by Jason Poulos on October 30, 2014 at 10:54pm

=) Honestly, I just can't even imagine why he went through the trouble of creating an account to post that. I assume he is not just a dealer of art forgeries....but perhaps Mantle forgeries.

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Permalink Reply by wascher on October 31, 2014 at 4:26am

As a mod I have the capabilities to look behind the scenes to see who folks are (just by looking a few things up), he signed in with a real pic of himself, posted where he is from on his profile, which is truthful, and his statement is more than likely one that is challenging you to think a little bit :) Its important not to jump to conclusions every time someone new comes in. Granted, I looked him up too (but I'm doing that with almost everyone with whats going on, in another thread)... but lets give him a chance to tell you what and why he said what he said :) and what he collects or sold.

-w

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Permalink Reply by burneggroll on October 31, 2014 at 5:33am

Wow, you hijacked your own thread; "eBay tells me...."They allow forgeries" I'm NOT JOKING GUYS." Glad you didn't miss my contribution about eBay. Thanks for recognizing that. Sorry about the rest of my post. That was just rambling. I did not want you to go all John Wayne against all forgeries. But, then you went to bad mouthing me anyway.

Back to topic. Yes, eBay allows "clearly indicated" forgeries. We need to convince eBay that ending review programs was a bad idea. Earlier this year, stamps and coins were the last review programs to be ended.

And centering in on autographs. eBay used to maintain a Banned Authenticators List. Last updated in 2012, the list is no longer on eBay's site map.

In the past, eBay considered banning sports autographs. Instead, eBay bought PayPal and upgraded the buyer guarantees. IF you meet all the criteria and paid for a misrepresented forgery with PayPal, you can get all your money back (price + shipping) and the seller has to pay return costs. In some circumstances, if you promise to properly dispose of the forgery, you don't have to return it.

BTW - my field of forgeries is very narrow; 19th century Japanese stamps.

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Permalink Reply by Steve Zarelli on October 31, 2014 at 4:15am

Actually, the product of famous forgers does have value and people do collect them. For instance, people collect the work of the famous historical forger Joseph Cosey.

I highly doubt anyone is intentionally collecting the mass produced modern fakes, but they are not quite the same as the work of master forgers from a century ago who created entire letters, poems, manuscripts, etc. that fooled a lot of people for a long time.

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Permalink Reply by Dom Vito Castiglione on November 21, 2014 at 2:55pm

Take a look at the crap this seller has up now! all those mini footballs that come GA COA! Ebay is doing nothing about!!!!!

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Permalink Reply by wascher on November 21, 2014 at 3:15pm

lol which one .... if you read this thread from start to finish so many people came in and left, I'm not sure who your talking about any more. I did laugh rereading it though---funny thread---and a mess to figure out whats going on and who's talking about who....

-w

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Permalink Reply by Steve on November 21, 2014 at 4:02pm

I mentioned those mini footballs a few weeks ago, all of a sudden, a bunch of Barry Sanders mini footballs showed up. Of course, Schwartz who is Sanders agent, knows nothing about these. You would think they would file a lawsuit against those who sell the fake Sanders items.

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Permalink Reply by Dom Vito Castiglione on November 21, 2014 at 5:06pm

It is surreal the amount of GA forgeries Ebay keeps letting him get away with. I personally was on the phone for 15-20 mins with Ebay and said they understood everything I proved to them about that seller and assured me they were going to "have their fraud department look into it further." That was weeks ago.

Go to his ebay page and click 'Sports original autographs.' Now click 'completed auctions.' There will be 360 forgeries he has sold since I called up to talk with them. 349/360 of those auctions came with a GA COA. The others came from PAAS.

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Permalink Reply by burneggroll on November 22, 2014 at 5:40pm

Thanks for the heads-up! Sorry about your typical eBay phone call result.

Angry rhetoric: Proved what? How do you prove anything to a non-expert over the phone?

eBay ended the review programs. There are no collectible experts or authenticators employed by eBay.

If you want it ended, you are going to have to hit the fraudsters in the pocketbook. Buy the items. Insist on the best (expensive) shipping. Prove the offering is fraudulent. Refuse to pay.

Before you do that: Be prepared to argue that your 'expert' is THE AUTHORITY. Make sure you completely understand the eBay Guarantee. Have a complete understanding of your payment service's guarantees. PayPal Guarantee is here. All the major credit cards have guarantees. Consider funding PayPal with a guaranteed credit card.

Do not expect law enforcement to help. See how the New Jersey, Bergen County prosecutor sells fraudulent autographs.

Permalink Reply by Sam Iam on December 8, 2014 at 1:05pm

Hey I ran into this Sam Rayburn/Bear character. He is selling in craigslist now.
http://lexington.craigslist.org/clt/4739647832.html
eBay have banned him from selling autographs!!!!

I emailed him about how he can no longer list his fake autos on eBay and he replied this "Im still making money little pup i you have no clue about steath ebay members do you i have been selling right under your nose LOL"

And "I have other partners LOL" "All you see is plaques LOL you dont know about the others do you LOL poor little pup go play outside with that is if you have any friends LOL"

He has actually opened another 4 ebay accounts and listed all the old ali fakes he had before but each account had them pulled. He would open another after they were pulled
I can't find if he ever had his own discussion but thought I would let everyone know here

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Permalink Reply by Steve Zarelli on December 8, 2014 at 7:41pm

Craigslist - Check

Cheap MDF plaque - check

Worthless COA - check

Long and unnecessary biography of alleged signer - check

How many more red flags do you need?

And why is it the lowlife fake selling slugs often add a long biography to the listing? It's like a page from the forgery seller's handbook. Is it supposed to make the listing appear more authoritative and credible?