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Beatles full signed color photo

Hello,

I bought this a few days ago in an auction.

It is an full color intact pull-out photo included in an 1964 UK-magazine called „Scream“.

I‘m very interested to know what you think about it, thank you.

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Permalink Reply by MrKite1970 on April 14, 2024 at 8:47pm

Thanks a lot, yes, I‘m very, very happy with it.

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Permalink Reply by a pug called eva on April 14, 2024 at 10:22pm

Certainly does seem a reasonable price for such an item but the auction results were a bit erratic and I don't think the price calls authenticity into question. Perhaps the "too good to be true" factor did put some bidders off, though with two solid COAs I can't believe it really did.

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Permalink Reply by michelle on April 14, 2024 at 10:25pm

what did it sell for out of interest and where did it sell?

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Permalink Reply by a pug called eva on April 14, 2024 at 10:29pm

$12,000, presumably before buyer's premium, at Gotta Have Rock and Roll:

https://www.gottahaverockandroll.com/catalog.aspx?auctionid=82

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Permalink Reply by MrKite1970 on April 15, 2024 at 2:33am

15000 inclusive BP.

To be honest, I was surprised to get it for that price.

My theory is: there were so many auctions, because of the 60. anniversary of the Beatles-visit that the item was maybe overlooked or the money was spent on items in previous auctions.

Does anyone have an idea, who can verify the item, because I want to be 100% sure that it is genuine.

Frank Caiazzo doesn‘t do this anymore, if I remember correctly.

Thank you.

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Permalink Reply by MrKite1970 on April 15, 2024 at 2:55am

Here is the unsigned magazine, and her correct name is Angela Deare not Dear.

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Permalink Reply by fab432 on April 15, 2024 at 4:07am

The autographs do look amazing. The whole notion of drawbots have me a bit worried by anything that looks pristine and perfectly placed. These forgers are getting even more sophisticated and it won’t be too far away when they will select 1 autograph from 4 legit sets from the same time period and use those as their template. Authenticators who rely on high resolution photographs will have a difficult time assessing the signatures drawn by these bots.

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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on April 15, 2024 at 4:21am

"and it won’t be too far away when they will select 1 autograph from 4 legit sets from the same time period and use those as their template."

I thought this was being done already. I thought we had seen this with Hendrix and inscriptions.

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Permalink Reply by a pug called eva on April 15, 2024 at 4:16am

But would these "bots" be sophisticated enough to create the ink blotches and spots seen in the George and John autographs? The little dot at the top of John's "e" is very typical.

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Permalink Reply by fab432 on April 15, 2024 at 4:24am

I think that is a very good question and I just don’t know enough about these boys. I’m thinking the software used to run these things is also going to get better and better and they will be able to make very sophisticated copies right down to the dots etc.

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Permalink Reply by fab432 on April 15, 2024 at 5:21am

I would imagine the software would redirect the pen to cover that area to create the desired effect. However I would assume that a forger would not need to recreate that aspect of the signature as it would appear to be genuine without it.

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Permalink Reply by conker on April 15, 2024 at 5:46am

From what I know about these machines:

1. The pen does not actually push down, the pen is merely dropped at certain points and dragged along the surface until it reaches the end of a stroke and is lifted. Hence there is usually no indentation.

2. The pen dropping/lifting mechanism does not operate at the same time the pen is dragged along the paper. So the pen can be falling from gravity at the same time it is starting a stroke but cannot be lifted at the same time it is completing a stroke. Hence you usually see 1 dot per stroke at the end, unless they plot in reverse.

So yes these dots *could* be strategically placed. But it would probably be more difficult to match multiple dots perfectly with a known exemplar than to just blend 1 that is out of their control in somewhere.

Regarding this piece, my 2 cents is the variance in darkness between ink P-aul and in M-cCartney would be too difficult to pull off without obvious dotting right nearby from multiple plots.