Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by JXE on July 19, 2020 at 4:56pm

Maybe for you personally. But I wasn't speaking for you. I said there is a resale market for this photo for those who know Ford's autograph and value a K9 cert over a PSA cert. You aren't one of those people. I am. The guy who offered to buy this photo is. The other people who chimed in positively about K9 probably are too. I don't own any K9 Ford autographs, but if I had to choose between a sloppy K9 Ford autograph or a sloppy Ford autograph that PSA thought was authentic, I'd go with K9.

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Permalink Reply by Mark Miller on July 19, 2020 at 4:58pm

Ok, I can go along with that logic.

Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on July 19, 2020 at 3:41pm

Fair enough.  I just wish that the seller would at least return his messages.  The pandemic has been contained here in New York for weeks.  I have prided myself on being an objective member of this website for years.  I never considered the reputation of the collector or the seller prior to posting a reply.  It is certainly not easy.  Take care, JXE.

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Permalink Reply by JXE on July 19, 2020 at 4:20pm

To be fair, I also posted examples of in person street scribbles that share similarities with the piece in question. Do you disagree with me that those examples show some of the same irregularities (starting the zig zags of the lower case letters before crossing the vertical line of the capital letter) and commonalities (the "am"-like look of the contemporary "Ham Farn" way that he signs) as the piece in question? 

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Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on July 19, 2020 at 5:43pm

Yes, I disagree.  I had no intention of bringing this up.  In the first, the “d” finishes typically.  In the second, it is not visible.  The third is a mess.  I commented earlier about how tragic it was for Harrison Ford to sign that way on a multiple piece.  The point of this discussion seems to be that Joe W’s Harrison Ford autograph failed to pass four TPAs.  Why not simply exchange it for another?  Is there a concern that the next one may not pass as well?  This should all be very concerning to small collectors.

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Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on July 19, 2020 at 5:25pm

Mark, you make a valid point.  The autograph should speak for itself.

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Permalink Reply by JXE on July 19, 2020 at 5:57pm

Mark was responding to my point that there are some Ford collectors who value a K9 cert over a TPA cert. What does a third party authentication sticker have to do with an autograph speaking for itself? Do these autographs speak for themselves?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Harrison-Ford-Signed-Autographed-Baseball-...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/HARRISON-FORD-Signed-8X10-PHOTO-INDIANA-JO...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Harrison-Ford-Raiders-of-the-Lost-Ark-Auth...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Harrison-Ford-PSA-DNA-Signed-Photo-Autogra...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/HARRISON-FORD-SIGNED-11X14-PHOTO-INDIANA-J...

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Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on July 19, 2020 at 6:57pm

I meant to say that Mark made a valid point about placing a seller’s reputation above an actual autograph.  Both should be considered in equal measure.

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Permalink Reply by JXE on July 19, 2020 at 5:47pm

Let's be specific: Joe W claims he got 3 "likely not authentic" quick opinions and 1 "inconclusive" quick opinion. That's different than failing third party authentication. And suggesting that K9 wouldn't exchange this photo because he's concerned that his other autographs might not pass either is as stunning as your statement that I am defending K9's reputation to preserve my own collection (even though I don't know the guy personally, he certainly doesn't know me, and I don't own a single K9 Ford). You don't have access to those emails between K9 and Joe W. I don't either. My only suggestion based on what he has shared about that exchange is that he should email him again. That's what I do when I'm unhappy with any kind of transaction, be it autographs or lawn care. 

There are variables at play that you don't want to recognize. Ford autographs range anywhere from $200-$2,000+ depending on their quality and what they are on. A trade makes things muddy. A Shaw autograph on a low value item is a fair trade for a sloppy in person Ford. What exactly should the new trade be for? a flawless Ford that would pass all of these quick opinions with flying colors and is worth significantly more than the original value of the trade? This is why I don't recommend trades to anyone except the most advanced collectors. There's too much potential for it to get much more complicated than a simple purchase and a simple refund. 

Yes, I think Joe W should pursue a fair solution if he isn't satisfied. But a fair solution is not having K9 sell the autograph for him and send him the money. A trade might be the right call, but it shouldn't be for a signature that's much prettier than the one we're looking at because quality directly establishes value in these situations. 

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Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on July 19, 2020 at 6:28pm

Here is a suggestion.  Trade back the Robert Shaw autograph.  Would that be too much to ask if it is still in the seller’s possession?

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Permalink Reply by Joe W. on July 19, 2020 at 6:32pm

I would agree to that in a "New York" minute. Return everything just as received. I didn't bring that up because I assume he was OK with what he received. He never mentioned that as an option either.

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Permalink Reply by Joe W. on July 19, 2020 at 6:18pm

I never started this discussion to target K9. But, it seems the best debate point is for members here to change the focus from the autograph to the seller. This seems a bit backward to the usual responses here. Usually, members here give opinions on the ink itself. In fact, when people inquire about a seller the response is "lets see the autograph you are considering".

I mean no disrespect to K9. None! But, there's got to be a better response than simply the "seller" says so. I have no problem with anyone who is satisfied with the way he does business. As long as both parties remain in agreement there is no problem.

Secondly, I did not ask for K9 to sell the Ford and give me all of the money. Never even thought that. I surely expected him to charge a standard fee. He has nothing to lose. It's not really a consignment because he was the source to begin with. He could have done this and the world would have never known. I only suggested that because he stated his autographs do not need any independent verification. They sell on his name alone. I never have heard anyone say that before. Why even offer an authenticity guarantee in the first place? Many outstanding dealers do not issue COAs and they seem to do fine.

But, when I offer an autograph for sale I understand that, in order to be successful, I have to guarantee it will pass independent verification. I have no problem being scrutinized as it is a part of how the hobby functions in today's environment. Whether I agree with a TPAs conclusion is irrelevant. I honor the the request and move on. It sure does make my life and the other party involved much easier than trying to score points in a forum group.

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