Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Joe W. on June 30, 2021 at 9:31am

Is was, Eric but the same can happen on a full cert. We've seen that happen far too often. Not to knock TPA services but mistakes happen.

Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on June 30, 2021 at 9:36am

And the other - the Bowie (right handed yet) from about 2 weeks ago. Yes indeed, too many mistakes from too many - without making a list. 

Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on June 30, 2021 at 9:50am

And someone saved $3300 + BP.

Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on June 30, 2021 at 9:22am

Simply, because it has not been examined in hand. In this thread it has been shown that items that pass QO can fail full exam, and the opposite as well. Judging from a scan is just not acceptable. There is the very Recent All Things Must Pass thread. Pre-cert was incorrect.

Permalink Reply by Eddy on June 30, 2021 at 9:30am

Sure, that's certainly understood. 

But again (and I'm just seeking clarity) is it not the reality that the board of those examining on here at AL will also not have the given piece in hand to judge it?

Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on June 30, 2021 at 9:35am

Of course, but there should be several opinions from our members, and the rules state the seller must include "Buyers must be comfortable with authenticity before purchasing." or words to that effect.

Permalink Reply by Eddy on June 30, 2021 at 9:53am

Ok, I'm going to give another gentle push....

Can we say for certain that this ("several opinions") are not also occurring with PSA or Beckett's quick opinion service?  I honestly don't know.  

Permalink Reply by Joe W. on June 30, 2021 at 10:15am

I try to go by what Phil Sears once told me. He said an autograph will never look better in person but can look worse under a live review. 

I believe that a look at a scan/picture of an autograph should be 90+% accurate if the reviewer knows the autograph. Sending it in for a full review likely will not change unless it's a pre-print, stamp, or some kind of chicanery.

Based on the sheer volume of autographs submitted to a TPA service surely not much time is spent on a review. It would take many "professional authenticators to properly evaluate the thousands of submissions". 

Finally, I wish these services would quit offering quick opinions. It's just a quick buck opportunity instead. Members here are more likely to be a better sounding board on authenticity than quick opinions by unknown eyes.

Permalink Reply by clarke nuttall on June 30, 2021 at 10:18am

I believe that a look at a scan/picture of an autograph should be 90+% accurate if the reviewer knows the autograph. Sending it in for a full review likely will not change unless it's a pre-print, stamp, or some kind of chicanery.

That’s spot on ^

Permalink Reply by Eddy on June 30, 2021 at 10:29am

I agree with you guys up to a point.  If you look around on say eBay.....one will encounter scans or phone photos by sellers in a huge gamut of visual quality. Phone cameras, which many of us use, have levels of sophistication as to their ability to take a clear picture.  Also, those taking the pictures have various levels of ability to do so.

I purchased a vintage autograph from a seller that was signed on a glossy photo. I began to have buyer's remorse before the item made it to me as I looked again at the not great quality supplied image. When I received it, lo and behold it was in a vintage ballpoint which, in hindsight, I realized I had not been able to verify at the time I paid for it before it was with me.  I was also able to see there were no "stops and starts" to the signature but rather flowed evenly which was not fully apparent from the seller's photo due to it's relatively low definition quality.  

PSA or Beckett would have been in the same boat in attempting to render a quick opinion with the seller's supplied image.  

So yes, it did look better in person...at least to me the buyer.  Again, I'm not trying to be contentious but just sharing my limited experience.

Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on June 30, 2021 at 10:22am

"...unless it's a pre-print, stamp, or some kind of chicanery...."

All that and more should be ruled out by the collector first. 

Permalink Reply by Joe W. on June 30, 2021 at 10:26am

As long as the collector knows the autograph. Pros make mistakes. Experienced collectors make mistakes. Novice collectors make unwise mistakes.

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