Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on August 16, 2012 at 2:27pm

I agree. I don't think Garry would ever endorse such an action.

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Permalink Reply by DB on August 16, 2012 at 2:39pm

BS!  It came out as a Board announcement and he is a member of the board!  Unless there are minutes and votes that are public and published then he is part of the decision.

Since he has not made any rebutal to the contrary then as far as I"m concerned the position has been endorsed!

In terms of fair play it would have been customary and courtesy to have shared the information with Epperson since he shared it with King.  Having said that, the post by Davies of but AFTAL as an organisation will not be drawn into personal arguments concerning dealers...  seems to be a crock.

This was not about the AFTAL OrganiSation but after reading this and publishing come to the UK to see the proof that Epperson misfired is a bunch of BS!

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Permalink Reply by Brandon Mysinger on August 16, 2012 at 6:58pm

Well, I was hoping you would chime in as such buddy :)  I will still leave the benefit of the doubt (even though the clock is ticking before I personally believe that he is "with" them)

I have no idea who Gary is. I do give him professional courtesy though based on what Steve, Roger, and others say. 

Still, the Harrison Ford he had ( possibly the other one listed too but I stayed away from it ) was bad. I was hoping that he would have detailed his findings on that piece too.

Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on August 16, 2012 at 1:40pm

It would be unbelievable for Garry to have signed off on a statement like AFTAL posted. I'm sorry, but this part of it is preposterous:

"In regards to the Michael Jackson autographs, the AFTAL board have reviewed photographic and dvd proof that gives conclusive evidence that the allegations you have made against Adrian are unfounded and completely without question untrue.

Our conclusion is that the Michael Jackson autographs in question are 100% authentic."

I can't imagine any authenticator issuing a statement like that unless they personally witnessed and tracked every item being signed.

I always chuckle when I hear an autograph called 100% authentic. How does that compare to one that's 99% authentic?

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Permalink Reply by Mike P on August 16, 2012 at 4:14pm

Not to mention the terrible grammar for such an organization!  I have done business with several members of AFTAL for euro-football pieces.  I never ventured into entertainment (except for a few MJs I looked at earlier this year) but I hope this is resolved in a civil manner.  

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Permalink Reply by Brandon Mysinger on August 16, 2012 at 6:53pm

I have no idea, his silence speaks volumes to me.  If he does have an issue with it, only he can step-up and say otherwise.

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Permalink Reply by Robin McKay on August 16, 2012 at 12:11pm

Agreed there are lots of elements to collecting and to protect themselves, dealers will sell with a certificate of authenticity and lifetime guarantee.

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Permalink Reply by Robin McKay on August 16, 2012 at 2:46pm

You can't make a decision based on just evidence like that, especially under the circumstances - OK they might be genuine MJ images or not, but that's the whole point of the debate, but that statement sounds like a get out of jail clause to me to satisfy collectors or at least patronise them in my opinion. 

I certainly will be more selective about who I deal with in future because as said, I've been stung, it ain't grand, it ain't pleasant, but hey ho, that's life. 

However, I wouldn't be satisfied personally with that statement - I'd get another opinion from another expert and if its proven false by a vast majority of authenticators, then there would be no choice but to refund the money. 

This to me makes it very difficult for collectors to get their money back should an autograph be proven false because in my opinion and this is what it sounds like. The Michael Jackson's are fake. Adrian has been identified as such as a scammer. Suddenly dealers find themselves in a hole. To protect themselves, AFTAL, or rather, the reputable dealers heading AFTAL come to a strangely unanimous decision they're real. Coincidence? 

You be the judge but in my opinion, well... make your own mind up. However, its not fact what I say, its the way I see it and who knows, the images may well be genuine but I'm not going to argue that as what I say is opinion, not fact. 

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Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on August 16, 2012 at 2:50pm

A child would reach the same conclusions Robin.  It is very frustrating.

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Permalink Reply by Robin McKay on August 16, 2012 at 2:53pm

But at the same time, it seems to me that its very shady Mike. Again, its opinion and as said, I will make my purchases carefully in future. 

Autographica is coming up soon in the UK and I shall perhaps be making a purchase from the upcoming show. 

Celebrity Authentics also has some nice images and may give OPX another look soon too to see if they have any images left of anyone but failing that, back to Celebrity Authentics - paying the little extra for the genuine autograph is worthwhile (especially in the case of Sig Weaver, that autograph was beautiful).

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Permalink Reply by Mike Shepherd on August 16, 2012 at 3:00pm

That has always been my philosophy.  Pay a little more money for a big peace of mind.  That is what is so upsetting about this discussion.  We are not talking nickels and dimes here.  We are talking thousands of dollars.  Sorry about the U.S. currency analogy but I don't know a pound from a ha'penny.

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Permalink Reply by J.Seah on August 16, 2012 at 3:06pm

Hi Robin!!!

I have been reading your posts in this discussion and you are in UK. Since you will be attending the Autographica upcoming show at the NEC Birmingham UK. I would sincerely request that you go and see the photos and videos proof of Adrian's MJ autographs as stated below by AFTAL post.

"Anyone wishing to see the photographic and video proof are welcome to attend the Autographica show on the 13^th/14^th October 2012 at the NEC Birmingham UK, where it will be available for you to view."

While you are there!! Have a pint of Guinness on me!! :)

Cheers!

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