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Questionable Stan Lee signed comics

Well, there's actually nothing questionable about them to me; I'm just being polite. Among the problems are the completely wrong 'S' and the fact that he simply doesn't write such a large signature.

ebay seller: jwantitihaveit 98.3% Positive feedback

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Stan-lee-autograph-SPIDERMAN-WOLVERINE-/251...

Here are 2 completed items from the same seller that I reported when they were first listed. Nothing was done and they were sold to unwitting buyers.

Here's the nice generic signing picture used for "proof", which was appropriated from this blog about the London Super Comic Convention

http://www.liveforfilms.com/2012/02/28/london-super-comic-conventio...

Here are a couple of legit Stan Lee CGC Signature Series autographs for quick comparison.

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Permalink Reply by Steve Zarelli on January 12, 2013 at 12:37pm
Every single one of this sellers comic related autographs are fakes.
Permalink Reply by Steve Zarelli on January 12, 2013 at 12:47pm
OMG. Looking through competed auctions, this clown has sold hundred of dollars of fake Stan Lees and others. Some of the Lees were $125 each, which is much more than it costs for a real one!
Permalink Reply by tiger383 on March 9, 2013 at 12:05pm

I am tiger383 from eBay. I bought all of these comics (plus about 20,000 others) and cards from a shop owner that went out of business (happens A LOT here in FL unfortunately). Nearly all of the comics I sold with Lee's signature had COA's. Everyone that purchased them were very happy with the purchases. One buyer even successfully authenticated a signed card through PSA/DNA. I have been in the hobby long enough to know when and why to question certain things, and I do admit that some of the signatures NOT accompanied by a COA were funny (for lack of a better term). However, I listed them with a full money back guarantee initially, but, ultimately, after talking with some friends as well as eBay customer service, I decided to take them down. I even willingly chose to offer refunds to those individuals who purchased any of these signed items without a COA. It was never recommended to me by eBay to do so. I know I probably won't be taken seriously because, after all, I'm the guy "on trial" here defending himself. But I HAVE to defend myself; after all, I'm not sitting at home trying to create the worlds largest collection of counterfeit Stan Lee signatures. I'm just a guy who bought some stuff hoping to turn a profit from it. I've been an honest eBayer for 14 years now. I'd never intentionally do anything to jeopardize that. Plus, I can't imagine being the guy on the other end finding out the auto I paid $50+ for is a fake. I have, in fact, been that guy before. So don't hate me y'all :)

Permalink Reply by Tom Schwartz on March 9, 2013 at 1:08pm

Nobody hates you, nor are you on trial. The simple fact of the matter is that the comics posted here sold by you simply were not signed by Stan Lee. It doesn't matter where you got them, it doesn't matter what generic COA came with them, it doesn't matter that people were "happy with them". They were not signed by Stan Lee, period, and they were rightly posted here and removed by ebay.

Permalink Reply by Tom Schwartz on March 9, 2013 at 1:49pm
Permalink Reply by Rick Meyer on March 9, 2013 at 2:49pm

Nice work on this thread Tom.

Permalink Reply by Tom Schwartz on March 9, 2013 at 6:38pm

Thanks Rick, I just kind of stumbled upon a little niche I could contribute to the site with, since these pop up on a fairly regular basis.

Permalink Reply by Steve Zarelli on March 10, 2013 at 5:56am
I have been collecting comics and autographs for many years. Up until the last 2 or 3 years, forged comic creator autographs were virtually unheard of. You could get a Stan Lee or Jack Kirby signed comic for $20. Many times, the seller wouldn't even mention the autographs... You'd just see them on the first inside page ( where creators often used to sign until CGC Signature series got into the act).

Sadly, now that the prices have gone up, I see junky fakes all the time. Thankfully, they are so laughably bad, they are easy to identify as evidenced by the childish imitations on we see displayed here.
Permalink Reply by Carl Ryan on March 9, 2013 at 3:50pm

I honestly smell something very fishy here. From what you have said, it sounds like you had your suspicions these items were bad, but still chose to sell them anyway. If you thought these items were "funny" looking, then why in the world would you list them? If you have collected autographs in the past and are experienced (which you said you are), then surely you would have taken the small amount of time to get familiar with the autographs you are selling.

I myself used to own one Stan Lee. And that Stan Lee looked like every other authentic Stan Lee out their. So when i looked at this thread i was pretty sure i wouldnt be able to offer an opinion. Yet when i looked at these, they didnt even look close to an authentic Stan Lee. In alot of them, they werent even ballpark. I mean it was that obvious. I then looked around a little bit at his past signature variations, and noticed very quickly these were bad items that matched no current or former style. This took me all of maybe 20 to 30 minutes. And if you knew the items were funny, then you would think you would have taken the same amount of time before listing them. To me it seems that you thought you could just offer a money back guarantee and maybe a little disclaimer, and that would make them okay to sale.

And could you post a pic of the card that passed PSA??

Reading your comments, you certainly dont seem like a forger, but I do think you had your suspicions about these items. Anyone who has collected autographs before, who cares if they are authentic, would have spotted these fakes a mile away. I would suggest contacting all of your past buyers of Stan Lee autographs and tell them of the concerns raised here.

I mean these Stan Lee fakes are just brutal, they arent even close.

Permalink Reply by Tom Schwartz on March 9, 2013 at 4:10pm

Yes, I'd like to see the PSA certed card also. I can guarantee it wasn't any of the ones pictured here, and if it was, PSA has a major problem in that department.

What's amusing is the strained logic offered by the seller that even if he had a legit PSA card, that it somehow makes the rest of this stuff authentic. It doesn't, it only speaks to that one card, and that one card only.

Permalink Reply by tiger383 on March 9, 2013 at 8:25pm

Okay, there seems to be confusion about what I was trying to convey with my initial message, and that's my fault. I was trying to be brief but effective, but apparently failed.  So allow me to clarify.

To Carl Ryan: I didn't mean to imply that I had suspicion from the get-go; that certainly was not the case. I mean, of course I had some suspicion to a degree since some were not authenticated, and one can never be too safe when it comes to signed memorabilia. I did countless hours of research comparing Lee's autographs on certified items from PSA, CGC, and Dynamic Forces as I found these three were the most abundant. I noticed at least a dozen variations in Stan Lee's signature on issues authenticated by the aforementioned companies, so I really didn't believe the variations in my copies raised any red flags. My Dynamic Forces COAs were in every way identical to other DF COAs. The other COAs were from a company called Catch-A-Star collectibles. I had never heard of them, so I continued research on the company and found they were in fact a legit company. The certs and comics issued with them matched items I had found sold on eBay and other online storefronts. Now, was I most likely blinded a bit by the fact that I had thousands invested in this lot and needed to start making money on it? Of course I was. I was being completely naive. So of course I was only going to see how things were adding up in my favor. It was an honest mistake; an error in judgement. Eventually, I guess someone flagged one of the listings so eBay called me and asked me to fax copies of the certs, so I did so. When they called me back to let me know SOME of the certs were questionable, we ended all the listings right then and there. I made the call to just end all of the listings, even the ones the rep said didn't raise red flags. It didn't go down like they wanted me to end them or whatever and I refused, so eBay just ended them and suspended me for being a forger or something like that. I was very cooperative, and was the one to make the call to pull these listings. There are still dozens and dozens of them from Lee, Siegel, Kane, Kubert, etc. piled on a shelf collecting dust; I haven't sold a single issue since, not even offline. As I said in an earlier message, I made the choice to refund the buyers. I didn't do this because eBay asked me to, and I didn't do it because a buyer requested it; I did it because it was the right thing to do. In fact, eBay never even suggested refunding ANYONE - which I found to be a little bit disturbing to be honest with you.

To Tom Schwartz: I didn't post on here to try and make a case against my items being posted here. I agree with you wholeheartedly, they are rightfully posted here. But I don't agree that my user ID be posted here like I'm operating a full-time forgery factory. You've taken it upon yourself to decide that I deserve to have my "name" forever linked to one bad mistake - and I think that's unfair. I didn't sign up here so I could argue the authenticity of my items; I wanted to argue the authenticity of my character. You only had 1% of the story and assumed the rest (and rightfully so), so I just wanted to give the other 99% to you guys. How many other people with questionable merchandise mentioned in this discussion signed up and posted here? That's rhetorical, I know the answer. I purposely exposed myself here, and NOT so I could be spoken to with condescension and judgement. To be honest, I don't even know how I came across this site. It was a happy accident. I think what you've done here is wonderful. But, can you imagine, just for a second, what it was like when I, a person about as honest as they come, stumbled across a site where I was on display in a manner meant to imply that I was a crook? Man, it tore me up to see that because I'm not a crook, and I rectified the situation. I ultimately did right by my buyers. And let us not forget, someone sold these to ME - and I'm not getting MY money back. So let's quit talking to me like I had an agenda to deliberately rip people off, because I was the first victim in this debacle.

All-in-all, I am glad to have found this discussion. For some time now, I have continued to wonder which of my items are authentic and which are not. I believe this discussion is a wonderful place to find those answers. Especially on the things such as the COAs that were deemed questionable, but, in every way, resembled the one's eBay deemed legit. Again, I never put myself out there so I could argue with any of you. I am grateful for your knowledge as well as this discussion.

Permalink Reply by Rick Meyer on March 9, 2013 at 8:37pm

You sound like an honest guy to me. I think you chose the hard right over the easy wrong. Not many would do that.

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