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PSA/DNA Certified Items - Right or Wrong

Not being a dealer or auctioneer I am perfectly suited to referee this discussion if need be. This section is mostly for Items that PSA/DNA has certified that in an opinion of authenticators has missed the mark (AND NOT as far as they know been corrected) along with any other items of significance.

 

In some cases the certification provided might be a simple rejection while in other cases it's certifying it as authentic when it may be far from it.

 

The thread is not about the good, the bad or ugly of 3rd parties as there is already an excellent thread in the forum on this started by R&R's Bobby Livington that everyone should follow.  That thread alone has produced three disccusions on Farrah Fawcett, Elvis, and now this.

 

Hopefully, AM members will follow this thread (I am sure the fraudsters & propaganda machines will) and point others to it - Perhaps, the owners of the item that is cited.  Those owners can then deal with the authentication firm or sellers and report back their journey.

 

Since I don't expect the PSA/DNAs of the world to come online and defend/refute (althugh the have an open invitation) the postings then be advised this is not a thread to speculate, accuse, or otherwise besmirch what is or what isn't being done.

 

So 'nuff said and on with the items.  To keep discussions focused and contained - Each Item contributors need to stay in the realm of that item so commentary is not all over the place.

 

remember if you post an item denote the PSA/DNA number on their sticker... One, if they choose can also validate the item's number on the PSA/DNAs database to see if it is in fact a product of PSA/DNA as we have heard that the fraudsters are/have created bogus ones and report your findings here.

Tags: certification, certifications, errors, forgeries, psa, psa/dna

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Brandon Mysinger on January 7, 2011 at 5:50am

Travis,  You know this is good old COMMON SENSE right?  It will NEVER work!  Common Sense was rare enough already but it died for good on Nov 4, 2008 ;)

 

 

Permalink Reply by DB on January 7, 2011 at 5:57am

touche!  and remember No Good Deed Shall Go Unpunished.

 

Problem with having SME in any field and when you just have that and not a "system" in place you need mini-SMEs in waiting.  Unfortunately, that doesn't always work well and when that fails we have to call upon the

 

dreaded "consultants" who tout themselves as experts.  Or as an Prez of a fortune 50 use to tell me in staff meetings - want to slow something down - hire a lawyer but if you want to kill it - hire a consultant.

Permalink Reply by kevin conway on January 9, 2011 at 5:45pm

 

I just posted a JFK study and request for opinions Blog.  Would like to hear your input:

http://live.autographmagazine.com/profiles/blogs/calling-all-john-f...

 

 

 

Permalink Reply by DB on January 14, 2011 at 4:15am

Sometimes, amends can and are made and it is unfortunate that they don't get publicized.  One such correction has been made with regards to Sonny Liston...

 

although this thread like all threads does get off track you may recall the above and how it didn't pass the 1st time around.  Perhpas the collective voices here (travis in particular), along with it's owner and a willing listener as in BL from R&R decided to give in another look. 

 

So they do correct their mistakes and when last I looked it had fetched $578.00 at the close of January's R&R auction.  I am sure Bjarne would have liked to have avoided the 1st go around but we also need to give credit when credit is due while eliminating the example with an incomplete story.  The story seems complete.

Permalink Reply by Bobby Livingston on January 14, 2011 at 4:21am
Actually, the hammer price was $932.  Nice going Bjarne and group.
Permalink Reply by DB on January 14, 2011 at 4:59am

BL - even better.  These places need more like you (although admittedly cleaning up the mess is a full time job amd an upaid one at that) when it comes to rectifying the mishits.  While everyone would like "perfection" on 1st pass we know better (at least some do).  This ought to take the wind out of the sails on the "saber rattlers" for awhile.

 

When you take the name calling and profanity out of the picture - what's left?  The "dung beetles" cleaning up the waste as Mr. Bill so aptly puts it.

 

At least this case has closure.

Permalink Reply by kevin conway on January 14, 2011 at 10:28am

But, do you need to big a large auction house giving PSA Thousand$$ a month in business before they will "admit" and correct a mistake?  OR even RESPOND to you??    I sent the below to them five days ago (their email auto responder says "we will respond within 72 hours) and have heard nothing.  Is it the typical "PSA Snub" we always here about?  

http://live.autographmagazine.com/profiles/blogs/calling-all-john-f...

 

 

Permalink Reply by DB on January 14, 2011 at 3:51pm

and watching that thread (well the 1st few pages) it would appear there are more magpies about with regards to 3rd parties than not.  I for one support and endorse the 3rd parties like JSA, PSA, PSA/DNA as well as some of the more reputable auction houses.  There was a JSA item on Hunt's auctions recently with regards to sports that garnished more attention than those without a 3rd party.

 

so I put it to a simple test with some close associates on some items;  1st question - does it have a PSA COA was a typical response.  More and more, whether we like it or not, it is becoming part of the fabric

 

and like the old saying goes Kevin, "money talks, bs walks".  If you want attnetion then you unfortunately need to find an advocate if they are ignoring you for whatever reason that is.

 

Kevin,  you said, "My client brought the letter to PSA to the SportMemorabilia show in San Jose this past weekend and whoever the sports authenticatorwas said “probably secretarial”.   Well, slap your client!  It's a sport's show and your client needs to address this with PSA/DNA, not you as you don't own it!!!!

 

It's really that simple - all you can do is try and act like an advocate which at this point you may or may not make the cut.  Even with Rez's endorsement...from an email, It's the owner that has to take action.

Permalink Reply by kevin conway on January 14, 2011 at 5:02pm

DB,

Have to disagree. My client is just a simple collector. he doesn't know PSA from JSA. he just knows (or thinks) PSA is the final word.  PSA says it is not genuine (irregardless if that particular authentictor's incompetence with non-sports or that particular signature)  and he doesn't have the desire and Shouldn't get into a battle with PSA, as he doesn't have the expertise.   All he knows is it didn't pass and hence wants a refund.  It is my responsibility as the seller/dealer to find out "what went wrong"

 

I don't understand your logic of  "It's the owner that has to take action" ??


Re: "and like the old saying goes Kevin, "money talks, bs walks".  If you want attnetion then you unfortunately need to find an advocate if they are ignoring you for whatever reason that is.".    DB, that thought is soo "puzzling" that is hurts my head....   Like what more could one do??  Other then a four page blog.

I also believe in 3rd party.  It is a very important service.  But, it is highly naive to think these PSA authenticators can perform these "Cross over" authentications and be "global experts.    All this lack of confidence you read here in these forums is a result of the somewhat shoddy process they often use, i,e, sport show doing 10 minute authentications on signatures that have about a 2 out of 10 on the experience scale.   Require them to OPT OUT and send it to the home office and have a John Rezz type analyze the Presidential material.  Have a Bob Eaton type input on vintage Hollywood. Have a Phil Sears type pitch in on Disney, etc etc... You guys stick with the Mantles and Babe Ruths.   But like any business if the service has a high enough demand and problems are severe enough a competitor will come along and take away market share.  I’ll bet disagreements with the authentication service market/industry lead to a company called JSA. 


I see an enterprenuerial opportunity in the making......

Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on January 14, 2011 at 5:28pm

Kevin,

Joe Orlando is the one you should talk to, and he's easy to reach. His email is jorlando@collectors.com. Tell him what's up and that you want to talk about it. People generally get a call back within a day, or he'll send you his direct or cell.

Steve

Permalink Reply by kevin conway on January 14, 2011 at 5:37pm

Hey Steve,

Thanks for that info, a great help.  

Kevin 

Permalink Reply by DB on January 15, 2011 at 12:48am

kevin, where you there when this occurred?  Most likely not.  Someone you allegedly sold a JFK to goes to a sports show where allegedly someone says it's most likely a secretarial.

 

and now you are stuck trashing PSA/DNA for their late response instead of saying frankly to this "naive" seller who just happened to purchase a JFK that there are formal steps one goes thru with authenticating via PSA.  And one doesn't accomplish this by going to a sports show as has been suggested.

 

You have chosen however to wear the monkey on your back while creating a tempest in a teapot.  The OWNER of the ITEM needs to submit it to PSA/DNA for an outcome and not some alleged remark garnised at a sports show in some context that neither you nor anyone else was present at.

 

how was the purchase accomplished as in thru what medium?

 

I'll bet Joe says, "send in the item for us to review".  However, if you take the tact taken in the JFK thread then I question there is a response.

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