Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Sam Iam on December 4, 2014 at 12:50pm

Epperson is the foremost MJ expert so it sort of does matter what coa it comes with. Doesn't it?
Maybe he can chime in here

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Permalink Reply by wascher on December 4, 2014 at 1:01pm

I was surprised to see the drawing of himself as a young person too (aka the self portrait)  He hated the way he looked at that stage of his life, and its in many many MANY interviews that he says this--even later in life he still talked about how he thought he was "ugly" when he was younger.  This is all too weird.

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Permalink Reply by roger epperson on December 4, 2014 at 1:31pm

Washer,

I have to disagree with you completely.  Van Gogh hated the way he looked and did MANY self portraits and the signatures on his and many other artists is not the same as the way they would sign a letter exactly.  These are all very similar because they were done by the same person and came from the same era drawings.  I'm not saying that I looked at all the ones that are on this site or at Gotta have it, but from the ones I looked at and the source they came from backing them up I feel you are all on a witch hunt.  You guys can't read MJ's mind and have no idea what kind of art classes he took.  I do.  This all is VERY common practice in art drawings and MJ was no ordinary person so his subject matter may be a little strange.  I wish all of this trashing of his drawings and sketches would stop.  Yes there are some that are not right and I learned that but I also learned what was right and most of the stuff you are trying to say is bad is not.

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Permalink Reply by AJ Jones on December 4, 2014 at 1:39pm

Are there any other exemplars of this style of signature?  And these images have strong backing? can you please inform the uniformed when it comes to this style of portrait so the "witch hunt" can come to an end?

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Permalink Reply by Max Rickardsson on December 4, 2014 at 2:19pm

Great you chimed in. Thank you!

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Permalink Reply by wascher on December 4, 2014 at 3:09pm

Hi Roger, everything about them bothers me and a few others, its why we're discussing them... We've all seen brilliant artwork by him, brilliant-from childhood on. And some of these don't even remotely come close to what we have seen as the norm for him. I have no idea who is behind them all, so for this to be some sort of witch hunt, couldn't be further from the truth.... especially when all of a sudden they are showing up everywhere. I wouldn't have any idea who we are even hunting.  I was told a few things last Summer were from one source, but I have no idea if the ones we're bringing up are from the same.

With the sig, I was surprised that 2/3's of them didn't have i's on them (with the rest of that style of signature).  I have seen one or two things that might have a glitch like that from him that roll into the c, but not over and over and over, nearly cookie cutter. And that they are two seemingly different era's (straight J's, and loopy J's) but all missing that i is weird to me. The first piece I saw, I figured it was a glitch. I really did, so I blew it off, and just looked at how odd the drawing was... mentioned it to someone this past Summer and moved on.   It wasn't until I saw it again that I took notice and again I said something to someone about it ---like immediately.  And then more and more.

I'm pretty sure you know I'd rather not be bumping heads with you.... at all lol.... like ever..... but they really really do bother me. So yeah, that's why I'm talking about them.

-w

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Permalink Reply by roger epperson on December 4, 2014 at 3:37pm

when dozens of Bob Dylan handwritten lyrics had shown up as well as dozens of Jimi Hendrix handwritten lyrics and unknown drawings and paintings showed up no one seemed to make a stink about it and they didn't show up until 30 years after his death (Hendrix).  The truth of the matter is that when Jimi passed there wasn't a market for autographs and writings but when there was a value and market then these all came out.  With MJ there already was a market for this kind of material and it appeared much quicker. There is no doubt in my mind that the MJ drawings I did and will do more LOA's for are without question authentic.  That same person who sent these to me also has sent me some that I have said were not authentic and that was without me knowing the source and they told me they got them from another source.

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Permalink Reply by Sam Iam on December 4, 2014 at 3:23pm

There we have it. Thanks Roger

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Permalink Reply by Max Rickardsson on December 4, 2014 at 3:50pm

It was obvious all the time if any bothered to check this I and Looped J issue.

Can´t understand that this going on for so long.

Thanks Roger!

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Permalink Reply by Max Rickardsson on December 4, 2014 at 2:15pm

After proper factual investigations I have found that Michael Jackson sometimes signed without a prominent "I" In his signature. Also the LOOPY J in question also was signed with that style by Michael Jackson. 

I have added proven signatures that show this characteristic by Michael Jackson. 

These signature styles with no prominent I and LOOPY J were mentioned that they were good by Wascher awhile ago " please view attached screenshot of her comments on that signature (signatures) were she went under the name Wendy Christine , who now goes under Wascher real actual name  far from a trained autograph expert , I'm even confused why she is even a moderator on here ? 

Is it because she found the fake Michael Bush forgeries that anyone who faintly knows MJ autographs would know ?! 

She contradicts herself many times. 

Here  are authentic MJ autographs with non prominent "I" and "J" loop and some without both.

First pointing out the drawings are traced , do some research , MJ traced using artographs. 

Many artists use artographs. Do some research. 

He traced many drawings. Proven facts are from the private hanger he did some of his works.  Because seems some of his proven artworks line up exactly overlayed. Have a look at the right brothers plane pic I added also. Please do your research.

These people on here the trio it seems all friends (lIZZIE = ) and yes I have all there actual factual names seem to work to discredit without solid proof. 

Well I have added some solid proof. 

 

And what made you Wascher to go under an alias from your previous USER name " Wendy ChristinE", why did you have another theory and belief of MJ I and J loops and now rejecting them as Wascher.
Do you have any respected third party authenticator supporting your claims or anything or is it just your own takes and thoughts ?

If so you´ve to make it clear- you force your opinions and present them in such way that they´re facts.-Stop it !!! it´s misleading.

You´re hurting honest sellers and confusing collectors.

And the fact neither PAAS or Roger have commented on these threads proofs itself what kind of circus you´re running.

There´s no need for you assumptions and non-factual claims on such respected board .

If you really want to discuss and question these artworks and autographs at this depth and level then at least tell us what your qualifications are and real name.

Why not start off and asking the auction houses if they have any provenance or letter of authenticity?

Girl, if we all started to analyze autographs in such depth without any credibility and qualification and presenting them for people and collectors here imagine what a mash it all would be, the level of confusion.

We´ve experts for that, Roger , PAAS, PSA and JSA.

 

I'm truly sorry I would not trust someone who has little knowledge of autographs to make assumptions. I would lean towards trained professionals who have approved these drawings.  I'm sorry for being harsh but some of there comments have left me no choice but to write back ,since this have been going on for too long without anyone putting sense in Wascher and making the readers aware of the truth.

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Permalink Reply by Max Rickardsson on December 4, 2014 at 2:17pm

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Permalink Reply by Max Rickardsson on December 4, 2014 at 2:18pm

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