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Has Autograph collecting become less of a hobby and more of a business.

The internet has made it easy to trade. With the birth of the ebay flipper, where is our hobby heading? Is the hobby more of a business for flippers who are inflating our loved autographs. Its not uncommon to see items sold at auctions and resold a week later for double the amount. There also seems to be more and more flippers around.

Whats doing more damage to the prices the flippers or the forgers?

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Permalink Reply by GraphingMlb on March 24, 2015 at 11:07pm

Whats wrong with Puerto Rico Sports,still a U.S Territory and all the ball players from DR and other spanish nations play in winter leagues there. Also When Texas leave the US,which will happen we will just make that little Island a state so we dont have to change the stars on the flag =)

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Permalink Reply by Sports n Stuff on March 25, 2015 at 5:04am

The comment states that the case looks mightily similar to another companies, that's all! Nothing says anything negative about PR or anything else for that matter! So relax...

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Permalink Reply by Josh Board on March 25, 2015 at 12:31am

This is an interesting topic. Obviously, the business side of things has hurt the hobby in MANY MANY ways. The most important being -- the celebrity doesn't like to sign because of it. If there was no business involved, most celebs would be thrilled to sign. They'd know they're doing it for the fans (on most occasions). We've all heard the pros/cons regarding selling and buying autographs, and many of you make valid points.

You can use this same logic for collecting sports cards, too. Kids used to do it for their favorite players. They'd put them on the tack board in their room, put rubber bands around them, and...for the player on their favorite team that sucked...those cards were put on their bicycle spokes to make really cool sounds. Now, it's all about rookie cards, MVPs, and not damaging a card that won't be worth as much as the Mickey Mantle rookie, because Topps makes millions and millions more than they ever did, and EVERYONE saves them, thinking they'll be worth money.

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Permalink Reply by Paul on March 25, 2015 at 12:43am

Thanks for everyone's input.
I have a question for the guys that have been collecting for years.
Was there ever a time when autographs wasn't a business eg before John Lennon died or in the 60s?

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Permalink Reply by Pete Bendu on March 25, 2015 at 4:53am

I can't speak for the 60's or even early 70's ...it was before my time. There were always autograph dealers, people selling the signatures of early presidents, authors and inventors, but these were usually people who dealt in rare books and stamps and other collectibles to support the autograph business.

The major turn in the celebrity autograph business was the 2nd half of the 1990's. SDCC and conventions all over the US brought in celebrities to sign autographs and most of them charged a fee. You could stand outside a NYC talkshow or Broadway play and expect to see a handful of fans asking the celeb going in or leaving for an autograph. By the late 1990's it was 100 or more people waiting, and by the early 2000's that number doubled with runners and kids being paid to try for an autograph (so they could hand it off to the supplier or dealer.)

The number of real autograph dealers hasn't changed much, but the wannabe dealers on ebay and elsewhere boomed. They made real money on ebay in the 90's and early 2000's and that brought in the forgers seeing a way to make a quick buck...they jumped in with both feet.

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Permalink Reply by Sports n Stuff on March 25, 2015 at 5:31am

I too don't have much feedback about the 60's/70's however people like mantle used to get so much mail that he had people in the clubhouse signing his autograph for him. Anyways, when I started & met some people whom had started(collecting/chasing autos) in the late 70's(they would sell autographs but not like today), my take is it wasn't such a business as it is now & didn't take off in the matter that it has until the 90's & honestly can probably be linked to 1st the emergence of cable TV(early 90's) & 2nd the emergence of the Internet(late 90's but mid 00's especially). Those two things opened so many avenues for them to be seen than read about in a newspaper or magazine!

A lot of the same people still chase autographs now as back in the 90's. and that's their means of income, whether selling on eBay, getting paid by someone or getting something for me! But from what I've heard everything's over things like Facebook, etc...so now everyone can find out where teams, actors, musicians, etc are staying! The person who still gets autographs for me just got a couple of Robbie Kruegers the other day but then got zero Spurs or Donald Driver(at a Charity Dinner). He said theirs easily 30-40 people outside the team hotel when back in the 90's their was maybe 6-10(max)! And now this is in a smaller city than NYC. I can only imagine the difficulty(or scene) in NYC!

Pretty much the Internet has opened so many avenues to buy, sell, forge autographs and has led to the big business it is! People will do anything to make a buck. On another site that's for cards...I was reading how the one person(my assumption is kid) was excited to buy a card for $.65 and sell it for $2. I guess if you sell 100 - 1000 plus cards its worth it.

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Permalink Reply by Scott Paul on March 25, 2015 at 6:12am

When I began seriously collecting in the early 70s it was very much a business albeit tiny by today's standards. I bought at yard sales, flea markets, antique stores and from catalogs. The old "Antique Trader" newspaper always had an autograph section. There were also dealers that issued catalogs and one in particular from Massachusetts I bought a lot of stuff from. I think I have copies of his old catalogs from the 70s I probably should dig those out and post some of the prices. I know I was getting autographed letters of Civil War generals for $10-25. I passed up an autographed letter all in the hand of Thomas Edison because they wanted $50 and I didn't think he was worth it. There were autograph collectors and dealers even in the nineteenth century often specializing in colonial figures. A lot of "book dealers" were autograph sellers. For the most part the catalog dealers were honest and very good. The double edged sword of eBay has put average people that never studied a signature in their life to the forefront of the autograph industry.

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Permalink Reply by Sports n Stuff on March 25, 2015 at 8:52am

Yeah I forgot about antique trader..ive been doing the same since a kid, hitting up rummage sales, etc. Rarely have I come across autos like that more sports related but I think that coincides with the times. Now with shows like American Pickers everyone thinks they have gold. I found a 3rd edition Uncle Toms Cabin ca 1887 for $6 at a rummage last yr and sold it for $40. Wish I would have kept it for historical significance however it supposedly found a good home and I asked a book dealer and they said with the condition I explained, which was pretty much 8.5/9 out of 10 if not better..it was worth maybe $100 or more. A friend I had shown it to was in a bookstore in Portland, OR and they had an edition for $8k-$10k. Anyways, you make a great point about the industry then..I forgot about that magazine and realize yeah theirs been a market just nothing like today's!

Do they still have antique trader around?

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Permalink Reply by Scott Paul on March 26, 2015 at 6:32am

You know I stopped getting that sometime in the 80s I think. I am not sure if they still publish or not. I suspect with the internet it is almost obsolete except for articles. I even bought a Civil War rifle through the "Antique Trader" for $80 and I think that included shipping! I kick myself now for not getting that Edison letter it was in a "junk" shop that bought a lot of "remainder" materials from auctions. I did buy a lot of autographs there mostly letters. My autograph collection has certainly grown due to the internet since the early 70s when I began. Back then word of mouth, magazines and newspapers were the only way to really to find dealers.

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Permalink Reply by Dane on April 11, 2015 at 9:40pm

The magazine must have been published at least through the 90s, and maybe even the 00s, as I recall seeing them at Borders and balking at the cover price.

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Permalink Reply by Joe W. on March 25, 2015 at 8:08am

Think of the autograph collecting hobby as a diamond with many facets. Some enjoy to obtain autographs in person for the thrill of the chase. Some buy autographs for their personal satisfaction of ownership without concern for future value. Some have a passion for becoming a dealer which is an honorable service to collectors. Some flip for profit or to simply grow their ability to upgrade their collection. I often sell pieces of my collection but for every dollar sold I've put two dollars back in. The one flaw in the diamond is forgeries and that will not stop but every effort must be made to weed the offenders out. In the end, whatever a person spends their money on they are the ultimate responsible party for spending wisely. For those who do not seek to understand what they are spending their money on then they are victims to themselves. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. The free marketplace has always been buyer beware.