Comment by Richard S. Simon on October 20, 2012 at 5:44am

Mike - nobody has yet asked you the $64,000 question. Who did you buy this card from? How much did you pay?

Comment by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on October 20, 2012 at 4:53pm

Mike M,

Thanks for doing the right thing. We all wish there were more sellers like you. Where did you buy it? How much did you pay? Maybe we can help you get a refund, even if you got it at an auction with a mo refunds policy.

Comment by DB on October 21, 2012 at 5:00am

what is equally puzzeling - is why EBAY has not cancelled the sale of the christmas card based on the information presented.

Comment by Mike M. on October 23, 2012 at 6:52am

Hi guys and thanks for the support, but I really don't want to say which auction house I purchased this from and for how much.  Lets just say it was something I would take back if I could.  I have already discussed the idea of a refund from the auction house and there is no way he will do so.  So with that being said I have "made my bed...now I must lay in it" so to speak. 

And for DB:  This might come out the wrong way and sound much worse then i intend it to, but I think you guys will get what I am saying.  The reasons this auction has not been cancelled are many...first being that this website/blog is meant for entertainment/learning purposes only.  No one on here (I don't believe) has that level of professional qualification to be able to testify in court, under oath (with 100% proof) against the validity of any signature.  There are also plenty of other reasons, but in this case at least eBay and the buyer have nothing to worry about since the buyer has already contacted me and intends on sending the signature into PSA for authenticating.  I gave her this site for reference and offered her the refund whenever the autograpg comes back (in case it does come back not likely genuine...which according to everyone here will more than likely happen).  I had told her about the fees for such an authentication and she seemed like she knew everything about the fees and had done this many times before.  I mentioned that $300 ($250 + shipping both ways) is a lot of money to potentially get nothing in return, but I believe in her heart she wants this autograph to be authentic.  We can all hope, but I assured her that the $1500 will be waiting in my PayPal account just in case it comes back with a negative response.  I called eBay and they have no problem refunding me my eBay fees if I give the refund after they have already charged my account.  So everything is in place for a refund if so needed and no one here is going to get "ripped off" except potentially myself.  If/when it comes back as unlikely genuine my wife might just keep it since she still lieks it...or I might frame it and put it up in my buddy's mancave for a conversation piece.  No matter what the outcome of this sale...no one will be taken advantage of and the most the buyer will be out is around $300 and that is something we talked about before she sent the item out for actual grading.  Thanks everyone and I really appreciate the support I have been getting instead of the negative responses that sometimes occur. 

Comment by Richard S. Simon on October 23, 2012 at 7:00am

Mike - when you give a refund to the buyer why don't you then report the seller to some local law enforcement agency to take action against the seller. Many local law enforcement agencies will act on fraud like this. Just because the auction seller says he won't give you a refund does not mean you should do nothing.

Or sue the seller in small claims court using the PSA report, and this website, as your evidence. You can act as your own attorney in small claims court and thus incur zero expense.

The piece will come back from PSA as non genuine, that I would bet any amount of money on.

Comment by Richard S. Simon on October 23, 2012 at 7:03am

ps. I have testified in court, in a criminal case,  and been declared an expert witness in New York State. The person I testified against copped a plea and served jail time.

I don't know why you would denigrate the qualifications of people on this board without knowing the facts.

Comment by Mike M. on October 23, 2012 at 7:23am

Hi Richard...Like I said in my post...I didn't "believe" anyone was qualified enough.  I by no means meant to offend anyone who might be or is qualified to do so.  And as for reporting the seller...I have been dealing in auctions for a long time (not eBay auctions...real live in person auctions and live online auctions).  When you sign your name to the terms of the sale you have agreed to said terms.  By either clicking "agree" for an online aution for registering and placing a bid at a live auction...you are agreeing to the auctions terms of sale...and most are "as is where is" and do not stand behind nor agree/disagree with any certifications that come with any items they may be selling.  So if I were to try to bring anything to court I would be wasting my time since I agreed to the auctions terms ahead of time with either a digital signature or placing a bid at the aution where the terms were expressed before the sale started (and are usually on the bidder card you are given).  Believe me I wish I could do something because I do not like being taken advantage of and feel sick about this and potentially other autographs I have purchased in the past not being authentic. 

 

Richard - I did not intend on calling anyone out on this board...I said that it would sound worse than I intended it to be...so I hope you can accept my apology.  By the way...how did you come about being an expert on autographs and do you recommend any readings or in person teachings on how to better spot authentic vs. non authentic pieces?  I am finished purchasing autographs until I can better educate myself in the field.  I currently hold quite a collection of many things and now I must look even closer at my autographs (even though some "professional" has deemed then authentic)...it is a shame that people would do such a thing to the hobby.

Comment by Richard S. Simon on October 23, 2012 at 7:27am

I was sworn in as a witness for the prosecution in a criminal case. The prosecutor then questioned me about my experience and qualifications. The judge then declared that I was an expert witness and could testify about the autographs in question.

And though I am not a legal expert i still think you can challenge the seller in a court of law. Try it, report the seller to the authorities. Report him to his LICENSING AGENCY. You have zero to lose and all of your money back to gain. I cannot understand any reluctance to make the attempt.

Comment by Richard S. Simon on October 23, 2012 at 7:28am

ps. Do you still have the other autographs you have purchased in the past? If so I am sure the board would like to see them and help you out on those.

Comment by DB on October 23, 2012 at 7:47am

unless of course we are speaking of the Princess Cruise Lines Auction House, which I have been led to believe is where this came from.  If that is the case, many many many consumer laws go out the window.  As has been noted on several of these legal action against cruise line vendors is expensive and an uphill battle all the way.  It's better to negotiate.

@mikeM - if you look at the one above yours it has been removed by EBAY.  Ebay typically has a black & white view of non-authentic items.

 

 

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