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What exactly is this eBay seller doing? Is this considered counterfeiting?

I suggest you review the items for sale by an eBay seller named: presidentialcollectibles

It appears that this seller is using a new 2012 autopen machine and is counterfeiting, ( if that is the correct term?), celebrity autographs. The seller's description states that, "These signatures cannot be found anywhere else", so it is unclear if anyone else is also currently using this autopen device. Thus far, one can purchase a Neil Armstrong, John Lennon, Marilyn Monroe, Bruce Lee, Babe Ruth, or Elvis Presley autopenned ink signature, and according to the seller "provides high quality signature which is an exact replica of the original".

For obvious reasons, I find this 'new autopen machine' quite troubling. Aside from the potential influx of confounding new autotypes, does creating these autotypes represent an issue in intellectual property law? I am not a lawyer, but..................

Should the profits of sales of the 'new autopenned' signatures belong to the estate of the signators?

Examples:

Tags: al capone, autopen, babe ruth, counterfeit, elvis presley, forgeries, machine-signed, marilyn monroe, mike tyson, neil armstrong, More…obama

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Comment by Richard S. Simon on September 17, 2012 at 11:08am: pres coll - are you aware of CMG, the company that issues licenses for any use of images of Marilyn Monroe, Elvis Presley and many others. They come down on any violators like white on rice. I suggest if you are going to continue using the images and faux signatures of those people that you contact CMG (located in Indiana, easily found by googling them) and get a license. Better to pay them now then to pay them a lot more later.

Comment by presidentialcollectibles on September 17, 2012 at 11:20am: Hi Richard

Yes sportsbuff is my id. presidential collectibles is my dads account. I used presidentialcollectibles for the historical type items and sportsbuff for movie and sports items items. I wanted to differentiate the two ... I am no longer going to used my fathers account presidentialcollectibles.

Comment by Richard S. Simon on September 17, 2012 at 1:23pm: Buff - So pres coll was for historical items, like signed baseballs and Elvis??

Are the baseballs being produced in China also?

You have yet to reference my question about CMG.

Perhaps if you get a cease and desist letter from their attorneys you might then pay attention.

Comment by presidentialcollectibles on September 17, 2012 at 7:13pm: Richard Im am starting to believe that small majority of people who are pushing to have me stop listing the replica signatures on ebay might have something to hide..maybe some of those folks have been selling these very same replica signatures as authentic.. ..why would anyone who is a serious autograph dealer not welcome a public reference site such as Ebay in which auto pens are publicly listed. It appears that the autograph community is not aware of these samples, I would think a reference would be welcome by any honest dealer. I would be willing to allow any autograph dealer to use my ebay photos on there website to educate collectors.

Comment by Richard S. Simon on September 17, 2012 at 8:11pm: What are you talking about?

Dealers have plenty of reference material.

We don't welcome what is happening because people whose motives are different then yours can buy your signatures and resell them as authentic. Do you mean to tell me you never thought of that?

And you have never answered my query about CMG. Have you a license to use the images that you are using?

And I question someone who produces a receipt that says nothing about the signature being produced by an autopen. Why is your receipt so worded?

Comment by presidentialcollectibles on September 17, 2012 at 8:41pm: Richard people are probably going to use these signatures as authentic....but not mine because the back of everything will be marked "REPLICA not an original signature" other sellers will probably find the supplier of these and try to sell them as authentic. so if my items are on ebay as replicas then at least the market will be aware of there existence. its obvious no one was aware of these until i started to sell them

Comment by DB on September 18, 2012 at 12:35am: right you are although it seems some may have been already there with china baseballs. It's good to see you are going to "mark" the back while unfortunate the one's sold are beyond that solution. Nonetheless, do ensure they are "well marked" on the back to ensure the clever ones can't be too clever. Although, it'd be nice to see some type of corner "seal" on the front as well (e.g. a PC RP Item) as most who will try and resell them don't depict the back of the item.

And as you have indicated EBAY sells alot of Reprints that claim from an "authentic original" which is also incorrect a greater majority of the time.

Comment by terrier8HOF on September 18, 2012 at 3:51am: this is very troubling. for every dealer like Presidential collectibles, there are a hundred sleazy crooks that will take advantage of this technology. this could be the hobby's equivalent to the swine flu epidemic

Comment by terrier8HOF on September 18, 2012 at 3:53am: we really need to consider starting a website that contains examples of these autopens as they surface, for reference, similar to some of the presidential autopen sites we use for the same purpose.

Comment by Richard S. Simon on September 18, 2012 at 5:09am: pres coll- why do you avoid answering the two questions that I have asked you before?

Are the baseballs made in China?

Do you have a license from CMG? (my guess would be no, since you have failed to answer that question multiple times). Are you aware of the consequences of not having a license?

Also - have you given the name of the "manufacturer" of these "autographs" to anyone else?