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Authenticity is Everything
Clark Gable?
Here's one I'd like to get an opinion on. It's a Gable signature on a Laszlo Willinger photo from a movie called "Strange Cargo." I've wondered about this one for a long time. I sent a photo of the autograph in to AutographCOA some time back for an online opinion. They said it was good. I'd still like to have some of your thoughts about it.
There is some guy selling copies of this exact same photo on eBay for about $10. It's the same identical signature in exactly the same spot as this signature. I've looked at this signature very closely under the lights. This signature was signed with a pen. I'd appreciate your thoughts.
Thanks Ladies and Gentlemen, Mike.ohotograph
Tags: Clark Gable
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Eddy on
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I looked back just now and see that I must have missed the Vivien Leigh discussion and it coming from Lights-Camera-ActionUK. If it's been discussed and determined there are issues with them, it's odd that the Davis is still up on eBay when it's been attributed here as coming from them (even though the eBay listing says Rutland).
As I said, I've never done business with either one. But it looks like a fair number of these are attributed as coming from them.
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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on
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Here Eddy:
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Permalink Reply by Patrick Michael Bratcher on
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That is most likely my mistake about purchasing it from Rutland. I went back to my purchase history on eBay and checked the seller. It was Lights-Camera-ActionUK. Both are out of England. Both are AFTAL Registered Dealers. I made a mistake. But I'm sure it will be my last.
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Hi Eddy,
It was one I would avoid. The last name seemed odd as noted. I was going to say in the thread that you should look at it! And then there is the apparent original source, Rutland. And again, Patrick is posting an item for opinions on authenticity while selling it. It got a negative albeit small response, but still remains for sale. And I already posted what I thought of Rutland and their Terms. Not endearing. After all this thread, and some messages, I had hoped Patrick would not sell items that he was simultaneously questioning. And as I mentioned to Patrick, the original seller is certainly going to say "authentic". I'm going to have to think about this all again...
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Hello group. I'm just catching up on the discussion. I'm listening. I pulled the Lights-Camera-ActionUK Davis number. I'll pull any others that you find questionable.
Earlier I read that Eddy said that he couldn't see how JSA, I think it was JSA, gave a COA to another Davis item. And that my good friends is exactly the problem. I don't know who to trust. I've read horror stories about all of them. I've also read and heard good stuff about all of them. Bottom line: I don't know who to trust when it comes to authentications. I look at Kevin Martin's credentials, they read very impressively. Is he not to be taken for his word?
Phillip Winters, for a pretty good while, I heard nothing but good about his stuff. He's a UACC and AFTAL Registered Dealer. Now I'm getting some negative input about his stuff. JSA may be putting out questionable COAs. Are they to be trusted? Honestly. I don't know who to believe.
I'm inclined to believe you, Eddy, Michelle, Steve, and other AutographLive members. Why? Because you are sincere, knowledgeable, and importantly as well, there's no big money involved in your "opinions." Big Money has a way of corrupting some of the noblest among us. That has always been an established fact. And it'll most likely always be the case, at least in this life.
Anyway back to the subject at hand. I heard one of you gentlemen say that there are some questionable items in my store. If you feel so inclined, point them out, and I will remove them immediately. It doesn't matter how much it costs me. Well, that's not true. It does matter. But it doesn't matter enough for me to do the wrong thing.
But let's get real about this for a second or two. Beckett, JSA, and PSA are multi-million dollar authentication factories. The pump out millions of COAs a year. Who are the people that do the authenticating? What training do they have? Are these companies adequately staffed to handle the massive workloads they surely deal with? Do they take the time to do a thorough analysis of each and every autograph? Where do they get their authenticators? What are their backgrounds in the field. These are all very relevant, and legitimate questions. I don't know the answers to any of them. I do know that they have great marketing, and public relations departments.
I also know they make tens of millions of dollars each year. However, I'm not saying they don't legitimately earn every dime. I'm just saying I don't know. But, I do have questions.
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Permalink Reply by michelle on
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well I am pleased you pulled it. You are right to point out that the 3 main authentication companies are primarily multi dollar businesses The best thing is to do your own research before buying or ask people who collect the particular autograph you are collecting before buying
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Thanks for the reply Michelle. I appreciate the good word. I've only been collecting a short time. I haven't met or gotten to know many people who actually know what they claim to know. Sure a lot of my store items have Big Three COAs, but I don't really know if they're really legit.
I'll be honest. I love collecting autographs. But I also buy them to sell, and at least try to make a profit on. I want to deal in truly authentic autographs, that goes for both buying and selling. But I will also must say that that it is a very dirty business. Crooks abound. Dirty dealers abound. I am making every effort not to be one of them. And I will be, if it takes every dime my creditors have!
If I didn't want to be a good one, do you think I would be opening myself up to the kind of scrutiny I'm undergoing right now? It's kind hard to have a lot of faith and trust in an industry full of people who are trying to take me for every dime they can con me out of. And it's not just me. Autograph fraud is a multi-billion dollar racket. Millions of people are being scammed out of billions every year. It's not an easy or cheap road to safely travel down. But I've committed, and I am following through. And I'm going to do it as honestly, and trustworthily (?) as is humanly possible.
Anyone got a bone to pick with me, here I am, let us discuss the matter. If I'm wrong, I'll yield. If not, I'll stand my ground. I do know that I don't know much. But it's OK. That understanding makes me more teachable, so long as the teachers know what they're talking about. Quite frequently it's hard to tell the true teachers from the clowns in this business. Anyway, I'm just rambling.
Thanks Michelle.
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I forgot to mention Eric when I was listing the people whose judgement I trust. Eric most especially, cause he's the one who has put up with the most of my nonsense! Plus, he's one sharp cookie.
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Thank you Michael. I appreciate that :-)
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Patrick, why are you selling this "Bette Davis?? Did we not just go over all this? After all your talk. You should not be selling items you are obviously unsure of. "...but the main question remains: Is this an authentic Bette Davis autograph....". That "Davis" should be pulled!
Bette Davis eBay (also posted here under "Is this Autograph Real?)
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That cut signature is one of 9 Davis items that are currently listed over there on eBay.
I don't want to seem mean, but I can't believe JSA gave a cert. to this:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/134381423385?hash=item1f49c1cb19:g:RLUAAOS...
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