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Authenticity is Everything
Beatles and Cassius Clay autographed glove
The story is that the Beatles and Cassius Clay signed two boxing gloves, February 18th, 1964, when they met. One glove was auctioned some time ago. The other is with a memorabilia store I visited a few days ago. I had never heard of this item, and have a picture. The signatures of the Beatles look very good! Of course, signing on a boxing glove has got to pose some problems for an authenticator. Has anyone heard of these gloves? What is the opinion of our experts? I asked for provenance. Owner will only say it was obtained in a "collection" and the store (which is well known) will give COA and guarantee. They will not say who obtained the autographs or the circumstances. The glove is being sold, authenticated by a "well known" authenticator we all know. What I find interesting, is that the signatures look very good, and seem to compare very well with the Beatles autographs from around 1964.
Tags: art of music, beatles-cassius, boxing, clay, glove, signed
- Attachments: No photo uploads here
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Ranjan D on
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What are you saying? Is my life now in danger too? Guys - Attaboy. You deserve a pat on the back.
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We also have to be more tolerant of others... This site as well as others needs to be about the collectors and perhaps a paradigm change is in order on how do we move beyond where we are. P.S. u forgot Rez, Hermann and a number of other dealers and perhaps advesaries (or some would like to think so).
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Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on
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Thanks, Chris. I love this site, all the friends I've made and the good so many do here. We're really making a difference. You can tell by how loud the bad guys yell that we're aren't making one.
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Permalink Reply by CJCollector on
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Absolutely, DB. John Reznikoff and Herman, too. My apologies for omitting them in my last comment.
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Permalink Reply by Fuddjcal on
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I agree with Chris's sentiments that you ALL (aforementioned) put your necks out there exposing this putrid under belly of the autograph world. There was NOTHING like this years ago. With these archives on this site alone, it is much easier for a collector to find information that wasn't readily available in the past. I know the information surely can't hurt.
Thanks Steve for trying to make this a safe fun place to discuss forgeries in the hobby and the people who are infecting it like a festering boil. I am sure it's a thankless job and others love to try throwing you under the bus probably daily. All you can do is go forward by putting out the best Autograph website you can, which has grown by leaps and bounds, while others have crumbled. Despite some attempts to derail the train, it's FULL SPEED AHEAD against forgeries and edumicating the public to the treacherousness landmines you must side step in the pursuit of a legitimate autograph!!!
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There are perhaps 25-50 people on this site who fight hard against forgeries. Every one of you are heroes in my book.
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Permalink Reply by Ben M on
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I stumbled on your forum while looking for something else, and while I have no opinion as to these particular autographs, I can tell you that as an acquaintance of Ringo Starr, I know there were "several" gloves signed by the Beatles and Cassius Clay on that day that were given to various charities.
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Geez, if that has any degree of accuracy there would be lots of publicity shots of such especially if it were going to such worthy causes. Odd, how there are no reports nor documented provenance by known eyewitness reports. If per chance there is such provenance as an "acquaintance" of Ringo Starr you would certainly have such sought after provenance to clear this up.
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Hi,DB: I met Ringo through a mutual business associate in the late 90s and have seen him once or twice a year since. You legitimately ask why there are no publicity photos or other historical record of a glove signing, and I have no idea. I saw Ringo a couple of weeks ago and asked if there was a signing, but don't know him well enough to press for more details. I have since been debating whether or not to post this information here because I didn't want to get into a long argument about it. If you choose not to believe this information, I'm fine with that. I know almost nothing about memorabilia and couldn't begin to guess whether or not this glove is authentic.
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I know this thread is old but here goes-
If you watch the footage of Ali and the Beatles you will know that this was not a 2 minute encounter. The footage shows there were 2 different photo ops. One with Ali in street clothes and the other on his training gear. The Beatles could have signed the gloves while he was changing as I doubt they went and hid in a closet until Ali came back.
Also Ali took a while to get ready - the laces on his boots alone took a while to get done.
I've attached pics that show Ali in the 2 different outfits.
Also someone mentioned Ali inscribed "Heavyweight Champ". - if I remember correctly this was just before his liston fight. It wasn't uncommon for him to write things like that as he saw himself as the champ in waiting - Attachments: No photo uploads here
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image.jpg, 93 KB
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Thanks, Carlos. The Beatles and Clay were together for two hours and in the 60s signing autographs was a non-event, so would not have been covered by the media. This was exactly one week before the Liston fight and this glove is not inscribed "heavyweight champ". I personally believe the glove to be authentic, but don't want to get into a long argument with the naysayers on this thread.
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I guess asking or Paul or Ringo will be the only way to know. Even Ali hmself. Easier said than done, but if they say they did, at least that would be proof gloves were signed.
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