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Authenticity is Everything
Odd Harrison QE 2 menu on eBay
While we're on the subject of George, how about this oddity currently on eBay with a start price of $1,500.
If it were genuine it would be great but I have pretty major doubts. It seems to be trying a bit too hard and there some very odd flowery bits. Parts of the inscription actually look more like Ringo's work (e.g. the "To"). Another big problem is that George was probably not on the ship on the menu date (2 September 1971). According to a blog I saw (that may be wrong of course) he boarded the ship on 22 September. If the dates are right, I hardly think George would have been asked to sign a three week old menu.
Thoughts?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by michelle on
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I also think its probably mega rushed but genuine and a lovely, quirky one off piece. Lets say it was signed by the waiter as the seller says,- that could account for the menu being 6 days old. would a waiter have had access/permission to just take current menus ? probably not.
However, on the negative side its not cheap so one would have to be really sure before bidding
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Permalink Reply by KarlKeaton on
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That's a very cogent point Michelle. It's probably not worth what he's asking for it anyway!
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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on
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There just is no reason - a current menu would not be a problem. But things from previous crossing are quickly removed and thrown away - they were of no value to crew unless you took it on the day. Clutter is not desired, especially with menus as you would never want to hand one to a passenger and cause confusion. So this is unusual.
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I just confirmed this with a friend and well established Cunard dealer who is very familiar with the previous Queen and the new Queens and how/why things are done and he agrees - highly unusual and unlikely for a waiter to save a three week old menu - it was worthless to him and actively not wanted in the dining area. To grab a menu of the day would have been easiest. As for the signature - I will leave that to others.
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Or thinking about it from another angle; what are the odds of somebody having a spare QE2 menu from September 1971, realising that of all people George Harrison sailed that month and then faking his autograph on it ?
At the end of the day the autograph is either genuine or it isn't. I would suggest that seeking a respected opinion as to the authenticity of the autograph would be a more productive approach to anybody seriously interested.
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"...what are the odds of somebody having a spare QE2 menu from September 1971, realising that of all people George Harrison sailed that month and then faking his autograph on it ?"
Perhaps as likely or moreso to a waiter having a three week old menu. I have not looked at the ink re signature. Dealers buy and sell these menus by date and passenger lists by celebrities on board - it would not be difficult to get a September menu if one were seeking one for...some reason, but harder to get one from the exact crossing in September. I'd feel a lot better were this on a menu with a date relevant to this crossing - not some previous journey 20 days earlier.
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The thread is titled "Odd Harrison" which then mentions some things with the signature and here we have an "odd" menu. Makes me look again.
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A current menu is the most likely to be used for such purposes, not something from a previous crossing.
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Permalink Reply by Jim Cushman on
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Keith Badman's book,"The Beatles After The Break-up: says that "George & Patti...along with Gary Wright return from NY on the QE2"....the date is Wednesday, September 22, 1971...
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After departing NY when? The departure date is the 22nd?
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If you ever have a chance to meet a Beatle...and you want an autograph...you'll take whatever is around...a scrap of paper...the back of a photo in your wallet...a check stub...or in this case a menu.....
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Permalink Reply by a pug called eva on
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I have asked the seller for additional background and he/she is looking for additional paperwork.
I assume this isn't a "family piece" or the seller would probably have given me a few more details directly.
I agree with Karl that a forger would really have had to "go the extra mile" to seek out a menu of a date around the time George was on the ship but there are clever and knowledgeable forgers around. Like Eric, I still cannot imagine a waiter keeping old menus or just having a three week old one to hand when serving or meeting George but obviously anything's possible.
I see the point about authenticating the autograph but if there is evidence that casts doubt on the provenance I am not sure that it would be authenticated or that I would want it even if it was authenticated.
Finally, the asking price is certainly not low. You could get a George for much less from all serious dealers. However, I think the size of this one, what it is on and the period it comes from (shortly after the Beatles break-up and All Things Must Pass, directly after Concert for Bangladesh and not long before his Dick Cavett appearance) makes its worth the extra.
If I hear anything more from the seller I'll pass this on. In the meantime, does anyone have similarly flamboyant Harrsion's from the early 70s?
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