1) If the "proof photo" shows only the celebrity and a "blank" copy of the LP in question it is not proof. If you can't see a matching signature clearly, what have you? Nothing. 

2) If the LP you bought has vintage damage not seen on the blank unsigned LP said celebrity is holding in their hands in the "proof photo" (unsigned), it is NOT proof. It is NOT the copy you bought. (Prove it is not a copy I own).

3) If said photos are altered beyond recognition, or are used to sell LP's that are NOT even shown with the celebrity, what are they worth?

4) Further, speaking of another "seller", if a seller can be shown to be factually lying on at least two counts, of great import, would this matter to you?  If the graph you seek is unusual from this seller - would you buy? Knowing he has lied twice over? And is currently selling demonstrable factual forgeries - would this matter to you?

5) If a seller says "I got it myself or I bought it at auction" and then refuses to reveal the dates or auctions, would this matter to you? Especially when the seller normally, despite claiming otherwise, states his sources, but...just not to you alone (because "you would't buy it if you knew where I got it"). Would this mean anything to you?

This is for another member - I hope to help them. 


PS - If the signature appears OK, but the seller swears that the "proof photo" is the exact copy being offered when it is clearly and visibly not - would you just pass on it?

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Comments anyone?

I agree. Getting really tired of this scam. The heading has gone from "proof" to "exact proof". No difference, their photo's show the celebrity signing, but never their particular item. And sometimes just shows the celeb, not even signing, but just standing there. What a joke, but I guess that they get some people to fall for it.

When confronted with this sort of thing, and motivated by the same annoyance with this scam as you, I used the "proof photo" in reverse deliberately - to factually establish visually the LP in the "proof" photo was NOT the LP being offered. Neither was signed. I enjoyed this.

Thank you Steve for commenting.

Those are a lot of questions but my general thoughts on proof photos are simple.

When a seller uses the word "proof" in his selling description, the photo needs to clearly show the artist and the exact item being signed.
Not another item from a minute ago, not a selfie with the celeb. Exact proof is what I need (the term "proof" is the same as "exact proof" for me).
IF (and I clearly say IF) a seller uses the term proof and fails on this matter I never buy from this seller. It's just too stupid (thinking buyers are blind?), because if he lies about one thing, he can lie about other things too.
Too many good dealers to choose from, so why buy from someone you have doubts on.

AGREE 100% 

I hope my friend will start to believe me re this type of thinking. I shall send a link to this.

Thanks - more responses welcome.

I've seen some (good) sellers doing this: Reusing past proof photos to validate items signed at a much later date. I'm sorry, but - no. The photos posted, whether exact proof or merely evidence, must be from the same encounter as the autographs or the tactic is misleading. I don't care if the autographs are authentic. Deception is deception, and the second I see it one any level from a seller, I walk away.

Agree 100%

Agreed, i have seen this done too by certain sellers too that are "trusted", I would rather people just be straight and say they don't have exact proof. It is the autograph that matters anyways. How does the autograph look? The problem is with modern signatures that are just horrible you need exact proof or who knows!

Unless it is pen to exact item any so called proof photo is worthless. Any unscrupulous person can grab photos off the internet to use. Ive seen some guys use the same photos over and over and one guy recognized one of his pics being used as somebody else's 'proof" photo! Here is a real proof photo,of course you also have to watch out for photoshoppers!

Thanks Ian! Nice pic too.

If you remember Gridiron Authentics, they were famous for taking generic photo's of athletes signing at various venues and then passing them off as their private signing proof.



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