Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on June 4, 2017 at 6:19pm

The sellers matter, but I care even more about collectors. 

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Permalink Reply by Mike White on June 20, 2017 at 2:19pm

 if they dont say its real u cant sell it

That's not true at all.

If you can't sell it due to authenticity concerns, it's because the potential buyer doesn't think it's real. Some may think that because they were told that by a TPA, but others use their own knowledge or the knowledge of communities like this one.

A good piece, even if it's rejected by a TPA, will still find a buyer in the latter group--unless they share the TPA's doubts, in which case your problems go deeper than the TPA.

when u deal with real authenticators for artwork they actualy tell u why its yes or no. like canvas not right age, paint not right., to much lead in paint 

So then the forgers who submitted the stuff can learn from their mistakes, fix the issues, and the TPA will pass it when they bring in version 2.0.

If that's the goal you're striving for, you're in the wrong online community.

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Permalink Reply by marc e on June 20, 2017 at 2:24pm

not true if they say its no good its tainted and cant be sold.

im in the right community ,i  guess you dont see logic of paying for a servic and getting it,

if i hire a document examiner for court they must tell they judge why the signiture isnt right ,im paying for there service .no differnce

take a pool on here how many people will buy something with out roger or steves  approval.very little wich is f up

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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on June 20, 2017 at 3:15pm

I do my own home work. I don't buy a sig I don't know. I sometimes ask for an opinion from Roger or Terrier or Ian or Pete (I am forgetting someone important) etc. for confirmation only. Most purchases are made "alone". I do not answer to stockholders - only me. It's my money and no will look after it as I will. I have no stickers. I think they are vandalism. They are free advertising. They are even red white and blue. I avoid slabs and papers. At best such items are maxed out in terms of value.

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Permalink Reply by Mike White on June 20, 2017 at 3:31pm

not true if they say its no good its tainted and cant be sold.

As I said elsewhere, they don't write "FAKE" on it in indelible ink. If it's tainted, it's not because the TPA said it's fake; it's because the person who was going to buy it thinks it's fake.

Real stuff that doesn't pass third-party authentication still gets bought and sold all the time because knowledgeable collectors base their decisions on their own knowledge.

if i hire a document examiner for court they must tell they judge why the signiture isnt right ,im paying for there service .no differnce

Big difference, the least of which being that you aren't in a courtroom.

I can pretty much guarantee you that the fees you'd have to pay to get the likes of Steve Grad to appear in court on your behalf about an item he's not connected to are astronomical compared to the fees you're paying for this service.

You want the service? Pay the appropriate fee. Don't pay for less and complain that you get it.

very little wich is f up

Citation needed.

The mantra of this board is "do your own homework; don't trust a TPA". Heck, there's an entire section here devoted to authenticity opinions, which are people noticeably NOT going to a TPA.

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Permalink Reply by Rick Meyer on June 20, 2017 at 8:32pm

I would if I thought it was good. Rogers opinion I value and like To have it. Steve's makes no difference to me.

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Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on June 4, 2017 at 8:01pm

I think you're getting honest opinions. I'd be shocked if there was any collusion going on. But all 3 of the big TPAs seem to have more work than they can handle and there can be big differences between the expertise of the authenticators in the same company. 

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Permalink Reply by wascher on June 4, 2017 at 11:18pm

I agree with Steve.  Also there are reasons they don't give out exactly why something doesn't look right.   The same reason many of us here don't go into exactly what we see when we spot something bad.  I've removed the same forgers from our site numerous times.... they show up and submit stuff here for a "look" - then learn from their errors. 

w

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Permalink Reply by marc e on June 5, 2017 at 4:05pm

if im paying for a service i expect a real explantion or dont charge me.there running a business not a guessing game

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Permalink Reply by wascher on June 5, 2017 at 4:35pm

I don't believe anyone has ever said that if you pay their fee, they'll tell you everything about the autograph good or bad.  Your paying for them to answer if they think its legit - yes or no.  And to give a cert if it is.

If you don't like how they do business, don't use em.

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Permalink Reply by Mike White on June 20, 2017 at 2:22pm

there running a business not a guessing game

It's only a guessing game for the forgers who want their stuff certified. Nobody else needs to guess because nobody else needs to know.

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Permalink Reply by Corey Moylan on June 5, 2017 at 7:56am

I agree. I have issues with the both Waters albums you have attached Steffman.

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