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How to handle a dispute? Please let me know your thoughts!
Hi everyone!
I would really appreciate your help regarding a transaction I’ve made with a trusted dealer (with a long experience of buying & selling) in a FB group where we can’t agree on a fair solution for both parties. I think it is most fair to not name either the dealer or the FB group and just focus on the facts.
Ok, here is the full (long) story: I sold two autographs for $520 to him and he got to choose if he wanted to pay a higher sum with Goods&Service or a lesser sum with Friends&Family, he chose to pay F&F. I then asked him if he wanted the package marked with a low value to avoid custom fees and he said yes to this. (See photo 1&2)
In my opinion both these choices were made to save the buyer money but both choises comes with a higher risk involved, which the buyer for sure knew since he has a long experience in the autograph community. I have myself bought lots of items where the sellers have marked the package low to save me from custom fees, always with the understanding that it means that it will not be insured and that I, as the buyer, will take the hit if something happens. I have always thought that was kind of a mutual understanding among collectors when marking an item with a low value.
The package was then shipped with trackingnumber and is trackable from me in Sweden to the buyer in the US. There is no way for me to put a $15 value on an item and then insure it for $520, since both shipping and insurance are bought from the same person at the postal office.
Unfortunally this time the package got lost, the US postal service has done an investigation and can’t find it.
The result of the buyers two choises above is that neither paypal (can’t use its buyer and seller protection since the payment was done with Friends&Family) or the swedish postal service (since it was marked with a low value) will cover for the lost package, meaning that if refunded I will take the full hit.
In my opinion I asked the buyer what he wanted, he got to decide what would be best for him and then I did as we agreed on. And now he still says this is all on me and that I should refund him all the money. I have offered him a 50% refund to be fair, although I tecnically don’t have to since he chose to pay with Friends&Family. And to be honest, the way he’s behaving I’m thinking of just block him and give him nothing back!!
When trying to explain this to the buyer he said that I was totally wrong and that he would make a thread on FB where he would ask the members for their opinion and according to him these replies would then determine how we settle this. But for some reason (!!!) he didn’t mention anything about him chosing Friends&Family and a low value on the package, that I shipped with trackingnumber and that I despite this still have offered him a 50% refund. If I didn’t know better it’s almost as if he did that on purpose to get the answers he wanted… He then uses the answers from the (misled) members to push me to refund him. And when contacting me with the results he for some reason only attach screenprints from the members that agrees with him, not everyone who doesn’t…
And now it has gone so far that he makes ”hidden threats” against me, saying that he will make a public post if I doesn’t fully refund him.
To get advices I’ve asked several of my long time collector friends how to handle this and one would refund even though he thinks the blaim isn’t on me, two would try to find a solution that both are happy with and the last three said that I shouldn’t refund anything, that the buyer fully knew what he was doing.
I have sold hundreds of autographs over the years and there have never been any problems until this autumn were two packages got lost at the same time. But the other had been marked with a correct value so after a long discussion with the swedish postal service (they never makes it easy) they finally covered the lost package and I could refund the seller and that situation got resolved. But the above is a very unfortunate situation for me. Here’s a link to some feedback I recieved at Autograph Magazine Live when selling here: https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/member-gogo?xg_source=activity
I would greatly appreciate your thoughts about this situation. Thank you for helping and take care!
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Dan Morris on
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Yes, although he had the option and chose F&F. Had he not have been given the option he would have had to go with G&S but chose to save money. Based on US shipping it's likely the item will still show up.
I like you never pay via F&F or offer it after being caught out but the seller and buyer share the pain and 50% is a fair result IMO
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I've asked sellers overseas to ship at cheaper rates by dropping by the tracking or registered mail. It usually works out. On one occasion the packet never arrived and the seller was going to refund but I told him not to as it was sent without tracking/insurance at my request. I assumed the risk.
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Permalink Reply by Cogo on
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I always wants tracking, but have asked sellers to put a low value. But in those cases I know it’s not insured and if it goes missing I as a buyer will take the full hit for sure!
I honestly thought that was a general agreement between collectors, F&F and/or low value = you as a buyer takes all the risk!
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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on
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The middle of a business transaction is no place to assume :( Clarity is always best.
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Permalink Reply by Eddy on
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You were consistent in your choice JK....not everyone is so consistent (or rational when push comes to shove, unfortunately).
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Permalink Reply by Bjorn VDB on
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It is said here that paying with f&f is no issue here because PayPal doesn't protect the buyer when an item gets lost.
But that is not true I'm quite sure?
If the buyer paid for g&s he could file a claim and get his money back.
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Permalink Reply by Joe W. on
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Cogo, you are a super person and I understand the anguish you must be going through. I've done business with you and would highly recommend you to anyone considering doing business with you. What happened in this circumstance is extremely unusual.
I still believe this package may show up. I've seen items get "lost in the mail" and eventually they show up. Hopefully you can work this out with your buyer if he is willing. I also understand his frustration.
I have encountered similar situations over the years and have become much more careful how I do business. You may lose a customer but doing things straight up is your best defense. Even then something may go wrong. It's a risk we all face from time to time.
Have a happy new year!
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Thank you for your kind words Joe! The same goes to you! And isn’t that what being friends is about, being able to disagree without anyone getting angry?!?!
A Happy New Year to you too!
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+1 agree My transaction with Hakan was smooth and pleasant. Would do so again. It's just policy, not Hakan. :)
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Before you refund anything Cogo I'd sit tight as I had a parcel I sent in July via economy courier to New Hampshire show up on December 15th after USPS declared it missing in October.
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