Authenticity is Everything
JSA, PSA, BECKETT - Authentication Stickers On or Leave Off the Item?
I'm starting to get some items in my collection authenticated for various reasons.. The biggest being if something happens to me, its less research for my family later on.. I'm going specifically to get a Carpenters vinyl authenticated to make sure my ebay purchase has another opinion before I'm no longer covered. That sticker will go on the LOA for sure for this specific item signed in ballpoint pen. There is no question of this being a reproduction.
Over the years, I've read a lot of old threads of collectors complaining about TPAs placing their stickers on the front of an item. This has me thinking, I'm also going to take a few index cards and cds where the sticker on the LOA won't be an option and will need to be placed on the item. Im torn with what is best for some of these. Take an index card for example. When buying on eBay, if previously authenticated, id prefer the sticker to be on the item and in front. Ive been duped into buying authenticated cards in the past where the sticker was not on the item and the seller tried to pass off a high quality reproduction claiming it was the original. Sometimes depending on the pen used, it can be difficult to tell between live ink and a printing. Its almost impossible to verify when buying items online just looking at pictures. I feel the sticker, as terrible as it looks, adds another layer of security, especially as technology advances in the future. This also goes along with framing. Once an item is under glass, it can be difficult to tell if is original or reproduced. Having the sticker visible seems like it should be more widely accepted for resale purposes down the road even if the item was never intended to be resold. It will eventually switch hands regardless unless you are buried with your collection.
On the other hand, these stickers are ugly and in most cases, collectors are able to tell the difference easily. Collectors are not the only ones buying these items though.. hard-core fans with deep pockets, who have no knowledge about authenticating, tend to rely on these stickers. At some point, I bet most of our items will hit the market again within the next hundred years.. It kind of makes sense to be more accepting of these eye sores and should be placed on the front of certain items I mentioned. If a sticker is hidden on the back of an item, once framed, how would you know without taking it all apart?
Wondering what everyone's view on this is. Im asking specifically about the certain items which can be reproduced and passed off as original. Items like glossy photos are not part of this conversation. Ive had some trouble in the past verifying heavy cardstock signed lightly with a rollerball type pen. Not impossible but can be tricky
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Jason H on
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JMS1223, JK, AustinCollector, BGK, Eddy, Eric and Rich
Thank you all for contributing. Today I attended a small card show in St Louis, at Machinist Hall. It was $3 to enter. Tomorrow would have been free but I thought there may be slightly less people there today because of the fee... JSA was right at the entrance and there was nobody there. Thank God because I was still out of it from being sick and had insomnia the last few days. I actually forgot to list one of my items when I dropped them off. Remembered a few minutes after leaving and rushed back. That could have been a disaster. We found it still with the pile and they added it to the list.
Because of everyone's input, I opted for the sticker placed on the LOA for all items. I was torn about the Ramis index card and Meg Myers signed handwritten lyric sheet for a while and its why I started this thread. Up to a few days ago, I was certain I would place the sticker on the front of these items. The lyric sheet specifically. If it wasn't for a few deep scribbles, it would be hard to tell if this was live ink vs a print.
Since I had the stickers placed on the LOA, I only had to wait an hour to get my items back. They said all 4 passed and the LOA will be shipped out later.
I'm very happy about the Carpenters vinyl. Even though I was certain about the other 3 (Richard, Gary and Doug), and all 4 were signed with the same pen, I kept questioning Karen's signature. She seemed to have a few variations over the years and I ran out of resources to verify this particular style. I figured JSA should have way more resources at their disposal. Even though I was confident, I needed another set of eye on this one. Here's the link to a post for that item
https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/the-carpenters-sign...
While I was there, I thought I'd add in 2 of my 11 Ramis signatures and one of my handwritten Meg Myers lyrics just as a start of authenticating my extensive collection. I of course was 100% sure about the other items and it felt weird giving a company $225 for basically 4 sheets of paper to be mailed later lol. Nothing really changed with these items. Its like I just gave money away for info I already knew.. im still not sure if its worth for other items. It would turn into a small fortune in the end if I authenticated everything I'd want.
Here are some pictures of the other items I dropped off with the vinyl. I think you will all be glad to know none of these were vandalized with a sticker
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Ironically, Bill Murray was right down the street tonight basically, on the Delmar Loop touring with a couple of his brothers. It would have been awesome to add him to this photo tonight but I passed on the opportunity. Ive asked around to see if it was worth hunting him down and a few people told me how he had been notoriously bad during this tour. Im sure he's doing this for his brothers to be recognized and knowing how Bill thinks, this rightfully should be about them. It would probably be a slap in their face to sign ghostbusters items with them around, but who knows. I was with my daughter and had already put her through enough. Possibly a huge missed opportunity but oh well. Maybe another day.
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Permalink Reply by eddy on
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Jason - I find this interesting as I've never done anything like that with a TPA. Were you able to watch them do whatever it is they do? Was it observable in plain sight, their process?
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I honestly would have loved to stay and watch but spent the hour with my kid at a playground while we waited. Although I wasn't really concerned about surroundings so im not 100% sure, but I believe they take the autographs into a non viewable area to work their magic. I know for certain PSA does this
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Permalink Reply by Eric Keith Longo on
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I'm picturing Frank Morgan at the end of The Wizard for some reason. ;)
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It would be hilarious and wouldn't surprise me if all they did was take a picture and overlap our item with known good signatures in the database like we all can do and call it a day. The difficulty for all of us sometimes is actually finding these known good examples.. I'd assume they also have a checklist like jiffy lube employees that they have to go over haha. Check for preprint, reproduced, autopen, pressure, and flow etc.. and just as jiffy lube does, im kind of surprised they don't try to dupe us by offering strange add on services after their decision is made as well lol.
I honestly have no clue though. It could be much more involved with vintage stuff and items they charge more for especially but with the mistakes they periodically make, id imagine they heavily rely on their own database of examples to compare to above anything else. This is just my opinion though. Im as clueless as anyone else
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I can't speak to what any of them are doing with Gleason. You see a few correct and think "Well, OK" and then you see something like this at PressPass (who don't care to address the problem beyond saying they will forward it to their listing team. with no result). Is is inexcusable IMO and a total waste of time and money and harms the hobby. Why would one even send this in...you mentioned "clueless"...the submitter and the TPA in this case.
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Not as glaring as mixing up James Gleason with Jackie Gleason .....
But shouldn't they know better regarding this Crawford secretarial style by now?
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I would hope so - that is her "classic" secretarial. although perhaps not as smooth as usual so even more disturbing.
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Conversely, there are instances where a well-placed sticker can be helpful to immediately identify a lifeless forgery .....
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Permalink Reply by JMS1223 on
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That doesn’t even look like an authentication company I trust. They could do better with a faked Beckett sticker, lol.
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