Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Kai Jones on June 22, 2022 at 9:36am

im not saying Jackson was squeaky clean. im saying he was found not guilty in a court of law and was never convicted of any crimes. you dont know. Josh doesnt know. And nobody knows besides MJ and anyone he supposedly molested.

your opinions/reasonings/and explanations for why you believe or dont believe are irrelevant. youre welcome to your own opinion. same as me. 

there are two sides to every story. i believe in the benefit of the doubt. again, judge not.

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Permalink Reply by Josh Board on June 22, 2022 at 2:53pm

Another thing people don't realize with MJ is this -- maybe he molested some kids, and not others. So I've heard Culkin also say he was never molested. But, I think it was also proven Jackson gave kids "Jesus Juice" (ie alcohol), so....it's all shady to me.

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Permalink Reply by Kai Jones on June 22, 2022 at 3:21pm

I dont expect you to read this as you seem pretty dead set on guilty in your own mind despite the facts but you might find it enlightening

https://www.google.com/amp/s/themichaeljacksonallegations.com/2018/...

But I’ll summarize the facts for you again just in case. The civil case was settled for a little less than 20mil and this was before the law changed as a DIRECT result of this case - fascinating study in the article above. Again, I challenge you to actually read the whole thing.

1. No criminal case was ever brought due to lack of evidence and the star witness refusing to testify against MJ.

2. Michael Jackson was found innocent on 12 counts in the “Jesus juice” case and died an innocent man in the eyes of the law.

3. Being “odd” and doing things a “normal” person wouldnt do are not crimes. Maybe in your own mind, but not by law. I think it could be successfully argued that Michael Jackson led the most extraordinary/charmed life EVER pre-allegations, which would most certainly qualify him as decidedly NOT a “normal” person living under “normal” circumstances or constraints at any level, but thats another conversation.

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Permalink Reply by JK on June 22, 2022 at 8:02am

I am not arguing in favor of Cosby, but I merely would point out that I believe his conviction was later overturned by a court.  

There are civil actions ongoing, but the bar for proving a case is far lower in those courts.

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Permalink Reply by Al on June 22, 2022 at 7:53am

I'm not convinced MJ was guilty 

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Permalink Reply by JK on June 22, 2022 at 8:03am

That's possible in theory.  But he was a weird (not necessarily evil) dude for sure.  It was presumably because of his upbringing.

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Permalink Reply by Josh Board on June 22, 2022 at 8:07am

JK -- for the longest time, I said the same thing. That I didn't think he was molesting kids, he just never had a childhood, and was re-living that thru those kids, going to amusement parks, etc. My logic was he had a bad/weird childhood and...if he was molesting kids we'd hear about lots of them stating that, and you weren't hearing that. But...when he said in an interview he let kids sleep in his bed, when a police detective told me they found child porn, and secret security on secret rooms at Neverland, and him settling for over $20 mil...that has to make you think, a person, as weird as they may be, would have legal council that tells you "If you settle for this much money, most people will assume you're guilty." Now, it could have been something like a legal expert telling him "You've admitted this kid slept in your bed, so...no jury is going to find you innocent." But again, if that's all they got, you fight it, you don't give people lying about your and slandering your name, a check for $23  million or whatever it was. You just don't do that.

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Permalink Reply by JK on June 22, 2022 at 8:12am

I am open to hearing any perspectives on Cosby, but in general I have come to believe that the popularity of celebrities is largely generational (or multi-generational).  

Some celebrities become timeless for various reasons so that rule would not apply, but for most, as their original fan base shrinks so does their popularity/value on the autograph market. That's just common sense, of course.

Some celebrities keep getting a renewed fan base so value might remain stable or even increase.  This most frequently occurs with musicians or actors whose work remains popular and garners new fans.  

What will happen to Cosby?  If his shows stay off the air then he will fade from popularity and values will follow. 

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Permalink Reply by Josh Board on June 22, 2022 at 8:13am

That's a great point. I hadn't considered that, and how it's different with musicians (because of radio stations playing the songs), versus a TV show that nobody is airing. Thanks for bringing that to my attention.

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Permalink Reply by Steve Zarelli on June 22, 2022 at 8:24am

Agree with JK. Between the unsavory legal issues and a shrinking fan base, demand for his autograph will only decline. 

At one point Cosby may have been a contender for "timeless appeal" .... he did have the biggest TV show for almost a decade... but the legal woes erased all that.

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Permalink Reply by Josh Board on June 22, 2022 at 8:04am

How is it people don't realize that if you're settling with someone for over $20 million, you obviously did something wrong? Now, before you can give me examples of the opposite, I will give one to you, and how they're different. Kobe Bryant settled for $1 million for a woman accusing him of rape. There could be a chance he didn't rape her, but he wanted to settle so he didn't have to go thru a long trial, where the prosecution brings out other women he had sex with (and cheated on his wife), details would come out about how he got the woman up to his hotel room, and things that his wife would be hearing and probably divorce him over. He probably felt it was easier to just settle and have this case "go away" and not lose all his sponsorships or his marriage. So yes, I do think you can settle a case and not be guilty, but again...Michael Jackson had enough money, and would want to prove he wasn't a child molester and he would have fought that, instead of settling. If you can't understand that concept, I can't help you. You just don't understand how humans work.

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Permalink Reply by Jason H on June 22, 2022 at 10:41am

I disagree. Some people are very private and there may have been some aspects, while still legal, would have been too embarrassing to have brought up. Whats 20 million to Jackson? He's not a regular person.. he could sit around while royalties pay it all. Anxiety plays a huge part in decision making. For someone as popular as MJ, im sure lawyers went through every detail of what would be brought up.. every aspect of his sexual life. Maybe some aspects would be too disturbing for his fanbase and he would lose more money overall even if every aspect was completely legal. I can see many reasons why it would be wise to just spend the money and have it done with. 

What it comes down to, do you believe MJ is an evil person trying to hurt others? I dont believe he was.. Cosby on the other hand I see as 2 faced evil and will do anything to anyone to get what he wants.

Ive never been one to connect personal life with autographs. Cosby was a small part of my childhood and nothing will change that. I wouldnt mind having his autograph as a memento of those times. Society needs to forgive. There should be more focus on rehab instead of just jail time. A lot of issues in crimes of a sexual nature stem from some form of mental illness or childhood trauma. For many people, their actions are very hard to control. Cancel culture should not take away his contributions to TV history. It can't be erased, only forgotten about.. in the end, everyone loses

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