Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Mack Lunch on November 30, 2016 at 8:03am

Mr. Zarelli is now acting as your mouthpiece as you still stand mute to reply to my questions.  I want you to tell me the provenance of those pieces that you deem as fakes or shut up!  Show me the trail of the Billie Jean prior to it being sold on Invaluable.  All I see is a fake of it after it had been sold there.  That makes the latter a forgery and not the original one that proceeded it!  Get your facts straight!  Your opinion is not Gospel and only hurts those who have valid certs to back them up and not just a lot of hot air!  As I stated, even PSA and JAS etc., all have been accused of authenticating fakes.  Where is your criticism of those items?

Permalink Reply by Lizzie on November 30, 2016 at 8:18am

Hi, I didn't respond in the first place because I was most likely asleep, due to the time difference between the US and Europe.  I  also have other commitments including family and work, so cannot spend a great deal of time online. I've never said that I was an 'expert'.....as I said, I follow MJ drawings across the world, on all possible platforms as I am interested in genuine MJ art.                                                            I guess that  you have seen the collection of MJ drawings published by ArtLima?  As you are a certificated expert I'm very interested to learn how you feel that the drawings under discussion compare with Michael's published drawings, which date from around 1990 - 2002?

Permalink Reply by Steve Zarelli on November 30, 2016 at 6:59am

Here we go. Coming in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1...

• What makes YOU an expert?
• Forensic is COURT APPROVED!!!
• Post phony anonymous complaints from ripoff sites
• You all live in your parents basement.
• GET A LIFE!!
• My lawyer has been notified.

It's an oldie, but goodie.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Mack Lunch on November 30, 2016 at 7:22am

Just because they are old points of contention  does not make any of them untrue.  Why not address the issue propounded to you by a new member?  After all, newbies have not heard your specious arguments.

Permalink Reply by Steve Zarelli on November 30, 2016 at 7:37am

Mr Lunch - It's quite simple. The market has exploded with a flood of bogus drawings since Jackson's death. Super collectors like Lizzie and Wascher have extensively followed the market and these signatures. They have spent countless hours identifying the forgery styles, tracing their sources, and publishing their findings here for zero personal gain or profit. They do this because they love the hobby and want to protect collectors from being scammed. Their only reward is the ire of vengeful crooked sellers who run them down.

Their opinion is highly credible to knowledgable collectors. Much more so than so-called forensic experts who rubber stamp everything put in front of them. Just because one has a mail order forensic degree hanging on a cheap frame in his or her office, doesn't mean they are honest or competent.

Are you the seller of some items that have been highlighted in this thread?

Permalink Reply by CJCollector on November 30, 2016 at 5:37pm

+1

2016 and people still believe that Forensic BS!!!

Permalink Reply by Prashant Kaushik on November 30, 2016 at 8:07am

Lizzie and Wascher are truly remarkable individuals in taking there personal time and energy to protect MJ collectors like myself from frauds out in the marketplace. And both do it with such a keen eye. We need people like them in the hobby.

And when I have talked to Wascher via email to get her trusted opinion she explains very thoroughly why she believes something is fake or real. It educates me. Truly grateful.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Steve Cyrkin, Admin on November 30, 2016 at 8:14am

+1

Permalink Reply by Mack Lunch on November 30, 2016 at 8:51am

I can appreciate their input but they must be fair and state that it is opinion and not proven fact.  They should offer how they arrived at their conclusion and let us look at that too so that we can see if they are being objective and not biased and based on solid reasoning. 

They should also go after the source of the items and not where they end up, such as eBay.  If eBay is the source, that is a different matter.  But when they come from Invaluable, a reputable auction house, who hosts Sotheby's, as well, that is where you should aim your criticism and not to the one who purchased the items from them.  Ask them for provenance, are the COA's from a reliable source, etc.

Permalink Reply by wascher on November 30, 2016 at 11:55am

Thank you Prashant & Steve Zarelli!   I appreciate the kudos.  

Mack we try to save members from ending up with forgeries, and unfort - you've been duped.

Permalink Reply by CJCollector on November 30, 2016 at 3:20pm

+2

If I was ever interested in a Michael Jackson signed item, Wascher and Lizzie are the first people I would seek out for an opinion....

Not some "Forensic" hack.

Permalink Reply by wascher on November 30, 2016 at 3:27pm

Thanks Chris, appreciate it. 

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