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Authenticity is Everything
Bob Dylan AUTOPEN Info To Help With Returns / Refunds - Simon & Schuster, Premiere, and Coles
***URGENT UPDATE
Previous update
Some users have uncovered potential autopen use within Bob Dylan's expensive art prints. Please check your prints if you own one and post a picture on this thread if you have any concerns.
here is a link to one of his art prints in question
https://www.castlefineart.com/art/bob-dylan/cactus
*UPDATE - Let this be a warning to ALL publishers and celebrities in the future. We are sick and tired of these autopen releases. Our community has had enough and absolutely will not stand for this practice to continue any longer!!!
I want to point out that Coles Books needs to be commended. They made sure to look out for their customers and refused to ship these out if they came from the same S&S stock, which they did. It was also an easy process to cancel orders beforehand if you wished. Coles. on behalf of everyone, I want to thank you for having integrity and watching out for all of us.
I can NOT say the same about Premiere Collectibles. They refused to honor cancelation requests until it was known these books were in fact autopenned. They advertise themselves claiming they are collectors themselves. This is not true. They are a retailer first and only care about your money. There have been other autopen incidents where they absolutely refused to accept blame, stating items were real when they were clearly deemed autopen by the community. Be careful with future purchases with Premiere Collectibles.
This email came directly from Jonathan Karp at Simon and Schuster. If anyone still wishes to send him a message, here is his email address as well.
jonathan.karp@simonandschuster.com
We apologize for the mistake that was made and are offering a full refund of your purchase. Please keep your copy of The Philosophy of Modern Song at no cost. We hope you will enjoy reading it.
Sincerely,
Jonathan Karp
Here are 51 articles and counting detailing our combined efforts on this forum
New York Post - Screenshot.jpg
New York Times - Screenshot.jpg
Los Angeles Times - Screenshot.jpg
Washington Post - Screenshot.jpg
Rolling Stone - Screenshot.jpg
Rolling Stone pt2 - Screenshot.jpg
Billboard pt2 - Screenshot.jpg
The Daily Beast - Screenshot.jpg
Ultimate Classic Rock - Screenshot.jpg
Poetic Justice - Screenshot.jpg
The Music Universe - Screenshot.jpg
I Heart Radio - Screenshot.jpg
Publishers Lunch - Subscription required
Spiegel - Translated Screenshot.jpg
Far Out Magazine - Screenshot.jpg
American Songwriter - Screenshot.jpg
American Top 40 - Screenshot.jpg
We Got This Covered - Screenshot.jpg
Healthcare Buisness - Screenshot.jpg
Sydney Morning Herald - Screenshot.jpg
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ORIGINAL POST
I am creating this thread as a comprehensive all in 1 link for returns, refunds, chargebacks and claims made regarding the "signed" edition of Bob Dylan - The Philosophy Of Modern Song. Please use this link to email Simon & Schuster, Coles, and Premiere Collectables as 100% proof these were signed using an autopen machine.
I would like to say right off the bat, Coles Books in the UK is handling this professionally and seem to care deeply about their customer base. They have stated that, once they are in hand, If they find evidence of them being autopenned, they will cancel all orders.. Kudos to Coles.. I wish all retailers would follow their lead. If you wish to cancel your order with them immediately instead of waiting, It seems to be an easy process.
This post will be continuously updated with new information over the next few days
Please refer to this article for the time being until more information is added
https://www.iheartradio.ca/newstalk-1290-cjbk/news/collectors-quest...
Here is the post I created a few weeks ago with info regarding the Indigo incident.
https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/indigo-bob-dylan-po...
So far, there have been a total of 17 confirmed different templates for the autopen machine used for Bob Dylans signature. I am in the process of creating video comparisons for all 17 sets. Please post full page photos of your item as they are delivered to aid in this process
Here are all 17 templates used by Bob Dylan - I am still looking for full page photos for numbers 8,13 and 15 thru 17 but its still best to post whatever you receive
Be aware when checking against your own copy, it has come to light that they are possibly using 1st and last names interchangeably. Bob in #2 matches perfectly with Bob in #13 while Dylan in both are different
14th variation confirmed
15th variation
16th variation - Seems to be almost an exact combination of #11 and #13 with a different vertical line in his "D"
17th variation
Video and photo comparisons created so far
Video of set 1 Dylan1.mp4 - Photo of set 1 Dylan1.JPG
Video of set 2 Dylan2.mp4 - Photo of set 2 Dylan2.JPG
Video of set 3 Dylan3.mp4 - Photo of set 3 Dylan3.JPG
Video of set 4 Dylan4.mp4 - Photo of set 4 Dylan4.JPG
Video of set 5 Dylan5.mp4 - Photo of set 5 Dylan5.JPG
Video of set 6 Dylan6.mp4 - Photo of set 6 Dylan6.JPG
Video of set 7 Dylan7.mp4 - Photo of set 7 Dylan7.JPG
Video of set 9 Dylan9.mp4 - Photo of set 9 Dylan9.JPG
Video of set 10 Dylan10.mp4 - Photo of set 10 Dylan10.JPG
Video of set 11 Dylan11.mp4 - Photo of set 11 Dylan11.JPG
Video of set 12 Dylan12.mp4 - Photo of set 12 Dylan12.JPG
Video of set 14 Dylan14.mp4 - Photo of set 14 Dylan14.JPG
Here are the COAs stating these books were in fact hand-signed
Suzanne Baboneau for UK - Certificate Of Authenticity UK.jpg
Jonathan Karp for USA - Certificate Of Authenticity USA.JPG
Coles listing before it was removed - Coles Website Listing.jpg
Important emails:
Jonathan Karp US - CEO of Simon & Schuster
jonathan.karp@simonandschuster.com
Duane Ward of Premiere Collectables
duane@premierespeakers.com - Others have tried duane@premierecollectables.com
Suzanne Baboneau, Managing Director
suzanne.baboneau@simonandschuster.co.uk
Ian Chapman, UK - CEO
ian.chapman@simonandschuster.co.uk
Bob Dylan's Manager
Jeff Kramer
OK Management
275 South Beverly Drive
Suite 215
Beverly Hills, CA 90212
Phone: 310-535-1647
Bob Dylan's Agent
Brian Greenbaum
Creative Artists Agency
2000 Avenue Of The Stars
Los Angeles, CA 90067
Phone: 424-288-2000
Bob Dylan's Production Agent
Sony/Columbia/CBS Records
550 Madison Avenue
New York, NY 10022
Phone: 212-833-7305
Bob Dylan's Law Firm
Manatt Phelps & Phillips
11355 West Olympic Boulevard
Los Angeles, CA 90064
Phone: 310-312-4000
Bob Dylan's Twitter
Tweet or privatly message Bob on his verified Twitter account.
https://twitter.com/bobdylan/
Bob Dylan's Facebook
Post or message Bob on his verified Facebook.
https://www.facebook.com/bobdylan/
I also found this email associated with Bob Dylans store. Its worth a try
BOBDYLAN@EPICRIGHTS.COM
Media Publications who may be eager to pick up this story - Please email them a link to this post and all related content
https://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/corp/contactus.html
For story pitches, please send:
News to Jim Milliot and John Maher
Soapbox ideas to Rachel Deahl
Features to features@publishersweekly.com
Related content:
Dolly Parton is also guilty of using multiple autopens in the same fashion with multiple templates over the years but with a slight twist where they manipulate the page as the autopen machine writes her signature. If we are looking to stop all future attempts at autopen usage, she needs to be held accountable just as much as Bob Dylan and S&S. Link to threads below
Here is a great example provided by Eric Keith Longo
Dolly Parton Autopen Example.jpg
http://www.feelnumb.com/2022/03/09/dolly-parton-fake-autograph-song...
https://live.autographmagazine.com/forum/topics/dolly-parton-signed...
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Bruce Juice on
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Now on eBay -- Under the Bridge 2019 -- anyone match this signature (or autopen) to another print?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/204170825496
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Permalink Reply by Jane Bond on
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My friend purchased this print under the bridge . I am suspicious about this. My limited editions prior to 2019 do not have a line crossing the y. This is part of the reason why I think the problem started with releases in 2019 as per Bobs statement. Castle are maintaining it was 2022.
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Jason H. Over the bridge. I disagree . It has every possibility of being caught up in this. When did he start crossing his “y”. All my prints before 2019 are not crossed
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Permalink Reply by Jason H on
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Jane, let me clarify my stance.. My research has lead me to suspect Bob has used the crossed y in his "vertical" style signature authentically. Things are always changing but I am more concerned with the style slanted towards the right (as used in the autopen templates). Research is ongoing but, while everything is suspect at this point (as well as it should be) I'm confident that signatures from Castle Fine Art are authentic as long as they are not slanted (handwritten or autopen). This is of course my opinion but I can not count how many hours of research I've put into this. Im still looking for any clues for his slanted signatures. If we can not find evidence of Dylan signing in person with this style, it will always remain suspect. This means, I believe the "under the bridge" signature posted above is possibly NOT authentic even though it is not an autopen. It seems to have been hand signed but in the style that is slanted to the right that is absolutely suspect
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Jason H. I agree sloping to the right is questionable. I have a large collection. I bought lighthouse in Maine 2017 release. Signature straight up - no cross on “y”. Consistent with all previous releases. Look at castle Website Woman in Red Lion Pub -2018 (pink dress) which was at least until the other day showing a close up of signature - no cross over the “ y”. Then on 2019 editions a cross is introduced. Look at the signature on Huon Province only print not sold out from Asia Series release 2021. Compare again on what we know is his last authenticated signing for a charity in November 2022 - no “y”. Just to reiterate again Bob has confessed to use of autopen 2019 and through pandemic years. Castle are saying 2022 releases only affected. If you question 2019 they say he signed releases years before - my argument then is - the problem then is much wider which by the way I do not think it is. Personally I would not touch any release from 2019 onwards until cast iron explanations and guarantees are given by castle.
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I agree with your last comment fully. possible even the end of 2018?.. I'm trying to determine the first instance of his right slanted signature but for sure 2019 onwards is not safe at all, I believe you are spot on with these assumptions and research is ongoing. I've fallen behind multiple times in the past few days as life has got in the way but have always attempted to catch up and stay current. Could I ask, has there been any absolute proof that someone owns an autopen version outside of the Retrospectrum Collection and Sunset, Monument Valley releases? Im seeing hand signed so far for others but still with the right slanted signature
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Jason H. Thank you. I personally do not think the 2018 release and prior are affected due to my comment about woman in Red Lion pub 2018 - look on castle Website. I am happy with all my collection except for Golden Gate Bridge 2019 and Asia series 2021 of which I bought two. All 3 have the crossed Y and slope. Your question re absolute proof - that is the crux of the issue. Castle are not admitting anything beyond 2022 releases. They say if questioned about earlier releases, so for example Asia released 2021 during lockdown , they were hand signed by Bob Years earlier. Do you feel comfortable with that explanation? I certainly do n’t. Why would a commercial enterprise like Castle sit on £3m of hand signed stock when they could release it knowing there would be a scramble to purchase it. ? There are 3 connected companies involved here. Halcyon, Washington Green and Castle . My questions to them would be 1. When did Halcyon agree with Bob to print and release Asia Series ( released Feb 2021 during lockdown when Bob has admitted use of autopen) 2. When did their publisher Washington Green print this limited addition print run . They are based in Birmingham U.K. 3. Did they ship the prints to the states for Bob to sign when / and how? Or did he come here to sign if so when and where? If the series was signed by Bob by hand then who was present and when - I think they have already admitted to not being present for the 2022 releases in their statement but what about 2019 to 2021. 4. If the unsigned prints left the U.K. to go to Bob in the states then when and how and when were they shipped back to the U.K. after signing. 5. Who in Washington Green added the edition number to the print and COA and attached it to the back of the framed print, when and where. 6. Same questions and answers please for the 2022 releases which castle have admitted in their statement were auto penned . I will say again Castle need to come up with concrete and indisputable evidence that ONLY 2022 releases are autopenned or give redress to all customers who request it for any prints they purchased from Castle in the release range 2019 to 2022.
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I LOVE IT!!! Thank you for being thorough and questioning all aspects with a reality based approach. could you email castle, Halcyon and Washington Green a list of these questions? Can everyone? I do want to look into this further before doing so myself with a rewording. (Its 530am here in the states and I'm tired lol) but I will for sure send them an email or 10 over the weekend even though I have no previous purchase with them.. Just asking as a concerned consumer
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Permalink Reply by Matt M. on
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Agree, those are excellent questions/points that I will be raising as well. I feel like that’s getting to the heart of the issue, that they don’t want to answer those questions and perhaps are unable to with any supporting documentation.
I asked here before but I would also like to know (maybe someone does)- when/where was this picture taken that they used to promote 2018 Mondo series? Was it taken when he came in to sign?
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